No start sometimes.

Tiny
J.T.70
  • MEMBER
  • 28 POSTS
I can already tell you my mechanic checked the pressure over a month ago. It was about 46 psi and it only dropped a bit overnight. He also measured the volume the pump was putting out and said it was good.
I feel the sudden easier start and no preignition after spraying cleaners into the TB says a lot about the possibility of carbon buildup. I'm going to bring it back soon and I want him to let me see the condition of the plugs. I used to have Delco Rapidfire plugs with a star shaped center electrode with 5 or 6 sharp points for the spark to jump from. Not the same as current Delco Rapidfire plugs. They were great for 11 years until one garage threw them away & replaced them with something they never showed me & without my permission. Problems started after that. For years I've wanted to see them but nobody wants to bother. Unfortunately that plug design isn't made any more. I really want to see these plugs and get an idea how much carbon is in the cylinders. The latest results indicate that I could benefit from another extensive cleaning.

I take this approach because I'm a chemist & used to be in the petroleum industry so I have a supply of some of the kinds of solvents often used in engine and gas line cleaners so I experiment with those. People often get good results just spraying water into the TB. I've done that since the 70's with no problems. I think the multi step procedure I used last did an amazing job. It's unfortunate that I have no test equipment, insufficient tools, can't identify many parts, and can't get at most of them even if I could. I don't work on cars other than to do the simplest maintenance. My job was in a lab. The closest I got to anything involving cars was that I could tell you exactly all the thousands of chemicals found in gasoline the 3 that make premium differ most from lower grades what the high boiling residue was and what cleaned it best. I remember coming in one morning to find the results of an analysis printed out overnight which was 17 feet long, single space type, & I had to identify every one of the chemicals on that list.
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Tuesday, July 23rd, 2019 AT 3:13 AM
Tiny
KEN L
  • MASTER CERTIFIED MECHANIC
  • 47,643 POSTS
Wow, way cool, I always wondered about the chemistry of fuels, now I have an expert ;) yes cleaning the throttle bore can help as well and the fact you can spray cleaner and it starts better tells me lack of fuel (fuel pump) which is common on GM, make sure you get an AC Delco unit and please replace the spark plugs with AC Delco as well

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/throttle-actuator-service

and

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/how-to-change-spark-plugs

and

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/how-to-replace-an-electric-fuel-pump

These guides will help walk you through the repairs needed.

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Tuesday, July 23rd, 2019 AT 1:04 PM
Tiny
J.T.70
  • MEMBER
  • 28 POSTS
Thanks for all your help!
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Thursday, July 25th, 2019 AT 3:13 AM
Tiny
KEN L
  • MASTER CERTIFIED MECHANIC
  • 47,643 POSTS
No problem use 2Carpros anytime can I ask if you found the problem?
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Friday, July 26th, 2019 AT 9:46 AM
Tiny
J.T.70
  • MEMBER
  • 28 POSTS
Hi Ken, sorry about the delay. In short, the starting gradually got better and better as long as I added cleaners to the tank. I even set a new MPG record for this car, 23.6 mpg vs 11 mpg at its worst. When I'd switch to a tank of gas only (89 or 93 octane, it didn't matter) it would begin to have the same kind of trouble starting again (difficult on the first crank of the day, instant on all starts after that.) This pattern was repeatable. My mechanic kept looking in the same places and found nothing wrong. He didn't test drive it enough or look at parts I wanted to see which limited my guesses. He kept saying fuel pressure & flow rate were good. I felt that eventually things would go back to normal or if the right part was cleaned but he wouldn't look at parts that gave the same symptoms a few years ago. Then in 1 day it sold at a garage sale so now I have a totally different car. Thanks for the help.
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Friday, September 20th, 2019 AT 8:52 AM
Tiny
KEN L
  • MASTER CERTIFIED MECHANIC
  • 47,643 POSTS
Thanks for getting back to us. Use 2CarPros anytime, we are here to help. Please tell a friend.
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Monday, September 23rd, 2019 AT 11:05 AM
Tiny
LONEWOLF7381
  • MEMBER
  • 4 POSTS
  • 1978 PONTIAC TRANS AM
  • 6.6L
  • V8
  • 2WD
  • AUTOMATIC
So the other day I tried starting my car but it wouldn't start so I bought a new battery and changed it out and it would crank but wont turn over so the next day I bought a can of starter fluid and sprayed it into the carburetor and tried to crank it over but I'm getting no power in my dashboard and nothing happens when I turn the key but my gas pump will run that is directly wired to the battery so I tested the battery and its reading 12 volts anyone know why I am not getting power?
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Monday, September 23rd, 2019 AT 11:05 AM (Merged)
Tiny
CARADIODOC
  • MECHANIC
  • 33,873 POSTS
Your description is really confusing, and the lack of punctuation makes it really hard to know how to read it. "Crank" and "turn over" are the same thing, so does it or doesn't it? Having to replace the battery suggests the starter isn't cranking the engine, but if you're using starting fluid, that tells me the engine IS cranking. If it is cranking, why are you testing the battery? What does the dash board have to do with cranking the engine?

Your car came with a mechanical fuel pump. If that has been changed to an electric pump, what turns it off if a fuel line gets ruptured in a crash?

Have you checked for spark?
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Monday, September 23rd, 2019 AT 11:05 AM (Merged)
Tiny
LONEWOLF7381
  • MEMBER
  • 4 POSTS
So my old battery was old and bad so I replaced it. I then tried to start my car and it would crank but not start so I went to the store the next day and bought carburetor fluid. The next day I sprayed some in and turned the ignition to on but none of the gauges turned on so I then tried to start it and nothing happened. So I tested the battery and it reads 12.3v. I have an aftermarket electric fuel pump controlled by a switch. No I have not checked for spark because nothing but the fuel pump gets power. Hope this helps
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Monday, September 23rd, 2019 AT 11:05 AM (Merged)
Tiny
LONEWOLF7381
  • MEMBER
  • 4 POSTS
By the way the guy I bought it from already had it installed so I just text him and asked if he installed anything like an inertia switch when he installed the electric fuel pump. Good question I never thought about that!
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Monday, September 23rd, 2019 AT 11:05 AM (Merged)
Tiny
CARADIODOC
  • MECHANIC
  • 33,873 POSTS
For safety, consider running the fuel pump later from a tap on the oil pressure sending unit. If a fuel line gets cut in a crash, the engine will still run for a minute until the float bowl runs empty in the carburetor, but at least if you're sitting in a courtroom, that will show you understood the potential danger from a fire hazard and made an attempt to address it.

The electrical problem sounds like bad cable connections at the battery. 12.3 volts is too low. 12.2 volts is what a good but discharged battery will read. A good, fully-charged battery will read 12.6 volts. You might want to charge the battery for an hour or two at a slow rate, but I think there's more than that going on.

Turn on the head lights so current is trying to flow, then measure the battery's voltage again right on the top posts if it has them. If you only have the side terminals, measure between the engine block and the larger terminal on the starter. If you still find 12.6, (or 12.3) volts, move the negative probe to a paint-free point on the body. An unpainted bolt head is usually a good place. You should find the same voltage there. Based on what you find, we'll figure out where to go next.
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Monday, September 23rd, 2019 AT 11:05 AM (Merged)
Tiny
OHYAH84
  • MEMBER
  • 4 POSTS
  • 1984 PONTIAC TRANS AM
I have a 1984 pontiac trans am 15th anniversary edition. It has ran beautifully for a while, until it died on my dad while on his way to work and now the car wont start or even turn-over for that matter(absolutely no noise when I turn the key) and it has a brand new battery so I'm wondering what is wrong?
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Monday, September 23rd, 2019 AT 11:05 AM (Merged)
Tiny
FIXITMR
  • MECHANIC
  • 9,990 POSTS
Do dash engine lights come on when turning key?
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Monday, September 23rd, 2019 AT 11:06 AM (Merged)
Tiny
LONEWOLF7381
  • MEMBER
  • 4 POSTS
Thanks I got it running, I talked to the previous owner and he directed me towards a wire on the back of the alternator so I tightened it and it fixed the problem.
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Monday, September 23rd, 2019 AT 11:06 AM (Merged)
Tiny
OHYAH84
  • MEMBER
  • 4 POSTS
Nope absolutely nothing.
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Monday, September 23rd, 2019 AT 11:06 AM (Merged)
Tiny
CARADIODOC
  • MECHANIC
  • 33,873 POSTS
Dandy. That would agree with the 12.3 volts you found, indicating the battery wasn't being recharged while you were driving. Happy to hear it's solved.
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Monday, September 23rd, 2019 AT 11:06 AM (Merged)
Tiny
SATURNTECH9
  • MECHANIC
  • 30,869 POSTS
Just to add to this one sounds like the alternator might have failed. Do you have a multimeter to see if the battery went dead?
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Monday, September 23rd, 2019 AT 11:06 AM (Merged)
Tiny
FIXITMR
  • MECHANIC
  • 9,990 POSTS
Start checking battery connections and fusible links on starter.
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Monday, September 23rd, 2019 AT 11:06 AM (Merged)
Tiny
OHYAH84
  • MEMBER
  • 4 POSTS
We got a new battery maybe a month or a couple weeks before this happened its brand new, we even tried to jump the car and it wouldn't start
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Monday, September 23rd, 2019 AT 11:06 AM (Merged)
Tiny
TYRFRYR
  • MEMBER
  • 2 POSTS
  • 1979 PONTIAC TRANS AM
This is what I have tried/checked. First off I built the engine myself. I am just stumped!
Compression is great! Spark is great! Plugs are great! Fuel is great! Battery is Great! Starter is great! Turns over great but won't start! What am I missing. Never came across this problem in the 12 years since I built it. The engine only has about 5,000 miles on it.
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Monday, September 23rd, 2019 AT 11:06 AM (Merged)

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