Ignition

I am sorry if I am a pain in the butt, but I did tell you I have minimal knowledge of what I am doing.

Are you picking it up?

Am I teaching you well?

I cannot sit by and do nothing, if I can assist with getting a (real) Jeep back on the road.

I will be here as long as you continue to respond. Several other Jeeps I have assisted have gone to well over 100 replies.

Any news with your distributor?

The Medic

It does not appear to have done anything nothing moved. What if I move it a lot what will happen?

Okay.

Is the cam follower (plastic piece on the points that rides the hex) still in the flat spot of the hex as it was in your picture that I "painted" on?

If so, that is where we want it!

Now, turn the adjusting screw CW (clockwise) until you see the cam follower lift slightly off of the flat of the hex (the whole points assembly will move). This gap you make between the follower and the flat will insure the breaker points are actually closed (touching)

Let me know when you are there, then we will do a test!

The Medic

I am sorry I found it a bit difficult to work on the Jeep this past week due to my transmission in my daily driver going out. Now that its almost done with a new transmission in it I am able to get back to the Jeep. I was actually wondering is there a better way that we can communicate?

Sorry about your other vehicle, it is probably not a Jeep! LOL!

This is how 2carpros works!

The best thing you could do is bring it over here to me and we could jump on hands on!

That would involve a heck of a tow bill to get it to the East Coast!

The way this works over here a 2car is: you ask, I respond, you do the tests, we figure out whats wrong!

Later (maybe even sooner) another feller reads what you and I have plundered through and figures out whats been going wrong with his 1972 CJ5.

(This may be how you came across the 2carpros site)

Any other route, that feller misses out on all of the fun!

Besides, there are other good things about working it all out here, There are about twenty other regular responding experts (and a bunch more of intermittent ones too) that I can depend on for assistance should I get stumped. We also have free access to many pay online references (vehicle manuals) that would cost a pretty penny for an individual.

Many folks get an answer like check this, check that, sounds like your catastrophic converter needs to be re-calibrated!

Pretty much they understand and are happy with the answer or they are still lost. We never see another response.

I started out here looking for an in depth Jeep answer myself when I stumbled onto this site in 2009. As I read through a bunch of short, sweet, complicated Jeep answers, whereas the question asker was left in the dark and never came back (I realized they would probably mess things up more than fix them).

CJs are super and are my cup of tea! Bad thing now days is everything is computer and complicated and the older carbureted vehicles fall to the wayside and fewer and fewer people really know them by heart!

So, over 10,000 responses ago from me back in 2009, I sort of vowed that I would really help out with the CJs by going to any length to try to get educate and get their CJ on the road again (I do answer other types of vehicles too).

Being laid up for months with a broken foot with complications got me started using a computer for the first time and plenty of time to repair CJs from my recliner!

I am all ears! Do not feel embarrassed or nothing, we like feedback!

Am I not explaining well enough? Bad pictures? I know it takes time, short and sweet stuff leaves you hanging, a Jeep manual is great except for everything is explained kind of scientifically and that sometimes leaves a beginner not knowing what to do.

So,

Are you still on board? I will stay as long as it takes!

The Medic

Great policy explanation CJ. :-)

Renee

Here is where we are standing now.

Pictures below.

Maybe I have explained this a little better/different.

Let me know when you have done this.

Then we can move onward to a good test.

Still lost? Let me know.

The Medic

Okay, we are there.

The beaker points now touch!

Turn on the ignition (key) to "on".

Do this when it is kind of quiet and maybe not so bright (not in the sunshine).

Insert a Popsicle stick or plastic whatever between the distributor shaft and the point arm.

Warning!

If you use something metal you will probably get shocked!

Twist or pry with the stick to barely crack the points apart.

You should hear a faint pop along with a blue spark between the breaker points.

Pry it open barely but very quickly over and over and over, you should get a pop, pop, pop, pop, pop along with the blue spark each time!

Nothing?

Turn off the key.

Fold a small piece of fine sandpaper in half or grab your cardboard fingernail file. Pry the points open and insert your sandpaper or cardboard fingernail file between them. Let go of the points and commence sanding for a minute or so! Remove the sanding device.

Start over!

Key on.

Popsicle stick

Pry.

Results? Popping? Spark?

Whatever happens (or does not), I am ready to tell you what to try next!

Picture below.

My keyboard has something under the "R", sorry if my "Rs" do not show all of the time!

The Medic

Your illustrations are priceless! But it is things even a dumb dumb like me can understand! Thank you! So I waited until it was dark outside and it is freezing! Sadly I did not see any spark nor did I hear a popping sound both before or after sandpaper. :(

Do you have a voltmeter?

$5.00 at "Harbor Freight", maybe $20.00 at a parts store.

Got to have one to continue. You can use it forever and ever.

Like my pictures huh?

I really try to get things down to K-3 level.

My "was" two year old grandson (now 12) asked me why I had a chock behind the wheel of my 1946 Willy's army Jeep in my garage. He had not really mastered the English language at the time. I was all alone baby sitting.

The only way I got it through to him was to set up a small piece of plywood as a ramp beside my Jeep (for effect). I put one of his heavy metal trucks on it.

I then stuck a scale model make-do chock behind his wheel.

We both looked at it for a while with puzzled faces as we stared at each other.

He was lost until I pulled the chock out and let his truck fly down the driveway and crash when it went into the grass.

At that point, I started to scream and cry like a little girl!

I regained my composure for thirty seconds or so.

Then I went over to my Jeep and acted like I was going to pull the chock out.

He was so very insistent,

"No, Papa, No!"

He has never forgotten that "In Garage" physics lesson!

Driver's side rear wheel in picture

Got Voltmeter?

The Medic

Let's try one more thing while we are at this point.

Turn the key off and re-run your temporary jumper wire from the positive battery post and back over to your positive coil post.

Now with the points being still closed try the Popsicle stick thing again.

Any sparking? Any popping?

The Medic

Voltmeter yes. However, I thought I rushed last night so I tried again what you told me and it is sparking at popping now. Much warmer outside than it was last night.

I am eagerly awaiting my next step.

Our time zones must have a significant gap.

Give me a little time, I just got in from the Veterans Day parade.

I was the only military vehicle there today, my other two buddies with Jeeps were sick today. The National Guard armory has relocated while their building is being revamped so they were not there. Almost a riot as to who was going to ride with me today.

The winner was 102 year old Mike who stormed the beach in Normandy.

Maybe I can grab a picture from a local online newspaper when they post.

Must eat and get warm now, four hours time difference, back as soon as I can.

The Medic

The anticipation is torture! I have to get up at 4:00 am tomorrow for work. That means I will not read your message until after work. :(

Same here,

Cannot answer till after work (about 6:00 PM EST).

You need some feeler gauges for next task. Get them!

See picture.

The Medic

Got them already.

You are so good!

Let's see if you can figure this out.

Let me know when you are out from under the hood.

The Medic

I am out from under the hood what is my next step?

All caught up?

Replace the distributor cap after you put the other goodies back in there (covers and rotor button).

Have a large wet towel ready if needed to throw on a small fire, and a fire extinguisher right there if the towel is not enough!

Pour two teaspoons of gas into the throat of the carburetor and quickly put the air breather back on (it will be the best thing to stop a backfire fire from even starting).

Attempt to crank it up!

After 2 or 3 tries let me know what the results are (any actions it does).

The Medic

Forgive me if I missed something but will not putting gas into the carburetor not do anything when I have no spark coming out of my spark plugs? I took the spark plug out with its hat on it and touched it to a ground and checked for spark but I am getting nothing.

Forget the gas right now.

We will try it again when I run you through another test.

Review

Points are now adjusted to .016" as per my last diagram?

Did you understand the diagram? I was hoping that would be self explanatory. Do I need to explain it better?

This is quite alright if we are not in the same Jeep. I will simply pull up behind you and give you another push with my push bar!

I just need to know what part of the trail you are stuck on.

The Medic

Yes I understood the diagram the points are at .016 they pop and spark. But from the distributor cap to the spark plug wires to the spark plug its self there is no spark.

With everything assembled back together.

Cranking the engine with the starter does not spark at the plugs?

I have not addressed sparking.

Remove one plug (Easy one to get to)

Plug the spark plug wire back onto the removed plug.

Ground the fat hex part of the spark plug to a shiny metal part under the hood (the ear of the alternator would work)

While holding it tight to the ground have someone crank the starter, watch the gap of the plug for a spark.

Watch out for them evil moving parts!

Is this what you have been doing?

The Medic

If you mean have I been testing the spark on the spark plug this whole time no. I am not a mechanic by any means but I can follow directions so to answer your question no haha. I have checked for spark with the spark plug out with the cap on with the hex to a metal surface a few steps ago and just now because you made me curious but there is still no spark there.

Sorry, it took me a while the air quality was really bad with the fires going on here and we stayed inside.

Okay,

I have been meaning to make this picture for years!

I can now use it a lot for other car questions.

This is so very important for me to know.

Is this how you are testing for spark?

I do realize you are a novice at all of this stuff, I found out in the army it is sometimes easier to teach marksmanship to someone who had never done it before, as they had not picked up any bad habits yet.

So,

You are doing fantastic so far!

Is this how you are testing for spark?

The Medic

More or less on the negative side of the battery. It is shiny.

You gave up on me.

Really busy!

Try the spark test on the engine somewhere!

When the sun is not so bright.

Any good results?

The Medic

Gave up?

Never!

We are at a point now that we should see some sparking!

Need that, then we can keep going!

Let's lightly sand them points some more. Do you have a helper?

Second picture, 102 year old WWII vet that I had the privilege of driving him in my Jeep in the November 11th Veterans Day Parade. He was pretty much able get in on his own!

I am hoping that some other folks will send me some pictures they took, I want a picture of the full Jeep in the procession.

The Medic

Still no spark. My heart is breaking!!

Where you been?

You have delayed a Jeep from being on the road by five days!

I want you to go back to November 12 (My answer, setting the points).

Set/check your point gap with the cam follower on a high point of the cam.

Now it is set with correct gap.

Do not turn the adjustment screw anymore!

Lets do a check.

Rotate the crankshaft with a wrench again. Let's wind up on the next high point of the cam.

The points should be open again!

Check the gap again with your .016" feeler gauge. It should shove into the gap and have "ever so light" tension against the feeler gauge.

Good? I hope so!

Now lets rotate the engine again until the follower (Oops, had to put new batteries in my keyboard) until the follower is in a flat spot, in between two high points on the cam.

Right now the points should be fully closed.

Turn the ignition to "on".

Verify that you have 12 volts at the positive side of your coil.

The negative side of the coil is connected to the distributor.

Let's do the pop sickle thing again.

Do not adjust the points leave the adjuster alone!

Just barely move the arm to crack the points barely open, do it really quickly over and over.

You should be able to hear a faint pop pop pop pop, and observe a blue spark in the points gap.

When you return, verify that your ignition switch works and is correctly hooked up. It does turn the engine over when it is in the "start" position.

What are the results of the "pop-pop" test?

Yes, I want to hear it running more than you do!

The Medic

Sorry the whole house has been feeling sick. Today is the first time I have been able to get up in a while we got some nasty virus. Anyway so you want me to start back at one with the exception of not touching the adjustment screw this time. Since it is daylight out can we settle for just the popping noise for now? Or is that what I did the last time and that is why we are back at this point again.

I thought maybe after the points were set (correctly and for keeps) you might have adjusted the screw again to get the popping.

We want the popping to work by only moving the crankshaft to move the distributor shaft so that a flat is lined up with the follower (points now closed) with the points already have been adjusted to where they should (permanently) be in the last step.

Mouthful huh?

Do you understand?

If we get good popping at this point, when it's all back together, we should have good spark at the plugs! (even if the timing is not right!)

The Medic

Have not heard any news?

You are the "star pupil", you cannot let us down!

I am anxious to hear that there has been some progress!

The Medic