Will not start

What engine do you have? Last time it ran? Background? Any changes from original?Let's see if this might be a fuel issue. The high rev is not a big deal now, we will adjust that later. Do this outside and with a big wet towel and a fire extinguisher real handy.

smothering with the towel is first line of defense, the extinguisher is last resort should a fire occur. Find you a cleaned out squirt bottle, I like the adjustable ones that have the round adjuster. Fill it with gas maybe a 1/3 of the way full. Have someone crank while you squirt some fuel into the carburetor throat. Should not take a lot of fuel to make it bust off and run. Now if it is running, continue to nurse it along with the squirt bottle as it starts to die out. How long can you keep it running? twenty seconds? Thirty? Longer?

The Medic

3.7l . v6.
last time it ran was five years ago beyond that it ran a few times in like the last thirty years. We have owned it since the 1980's and I am not aware of any changes, but there could be a few. it needs serious work, all the brakes and shocks are blown out. I have it up on jack stands right now and am going to convert all the brakes to disc if I can get it started and find the engine is still viable. As soon as my wife gets back I will try the the procedure and get back to you.

PS. yesterday when messing with it there was fuel coming out of the vacuum port that goes to the distributor, that has not happened today though.

Thank you for your help!

Glad to see you getting him ready to rule the roads again.

New carburetor? Now or new five years ago?

Still using points in the distributor?

I have been contemplating discs on the front of my 1946 (maybe rear too). I have seen homemade or Frankenstein versions sorta reasonable, then there are the kits from sites, $700.00-$1,000.00 or more, just are not real inviting.

My brakes work correctly, for 1946 standards, but 9" just do not stop like 11"!

Then there is the "OMG, gear down, swerve, maybe jump the curb!" moments when I am not driving in the "grandma mode" and need to stop right now!

I pretty much have it down pat on how to use the brakes of seventy one years ago, however the everyday brakes of the 1977 sort of spoil me and transitioning back to the 1946 sometimes takes a little refresher time.

On my 1946, fixed shoes at the bottom, drums are pressed onto the hubs (pain to get to the shoes). Adjustments are all manual and very difficult to do.

These kind of memories from each time steer me more and more towards the discs.

We like to see what is pulling into our garage, snap us a picture or two!

The Medic

My wife was scared to try the test last night, so I just got her to do it now. Pour gas down the throat, I could keep it running for as long as I wanted. My wife counted thirty nine seconds when I told her to shut it off. I could of kept going but did not want to push my luck with a fire or something.

The carburetor is brand new as of a couple weeks ago and I am not sure what you mean with the distributor question. can you please clarify?

I am very excited to get this jeep going it is a big part of the very few good childhood memories that I can remember.

Thanks again for the help!

Matt

Backing plates for brakes on these old Jeeps are tough to find this played into my decision to just spend the money and upgrade the brakes. The other biggest thing was the hub puller that I spent probably $200.00 on. The first hub puller from Amazon for forty bucks striped out, so I had to buy some fancy expensive one to use twice. Also, my drums and hubs are permanently mated, so add that to the list. Finally, my friend telling me that I might lose my mind trying to get the drum brakes back together. My original plan was eleven inch drums all around, but that is far gone. Here are some rough pictures.

Your Distributor originally has points in it. My '46 (with Flathead 4 cyl) has similar ones

SEE PIC 1

I upgraded mine to "Pertronics", a simple electronic ignition system made for specific distributors (no more playing with points for me!)

People change stuff over the years, I wanted to know what we were dealing with, should it be a spark issue.

SEE PICs 2 and 3

My questions/Tests were aimed at "do you not have spark?" or "do you not have fuel?"

Obviously you have spark!

Your fuel ain't getting there, somewhere between the tank and getting into the carb throat

As we proved it will run if you dump fuel into the throat (since it ain't getting there on it's own).

Many possibilities along the way.

My firstus test would be to take a rubber line loose near the carb and turn the engine over a few times to see if fuel is pumping up to that point. Again, Outside with Fire Equipment!

Depending on your results, we will know which direction to go.

Earlier you mentioned fuel coming out of the vacuum port, this "could/maybe/ possibly" indicate your carbs float being (or was) stuck up (open, needle valve not shutting off).

This above situation might let the carbs fuel bowl overfill and fuel start running out any hole it can find.

During your carb installation, did you back hold the carbs fuel inlet with a wrench to prevent it from turning while you installed the fuel line?

If you just "cranked it on in" and the carb fitting turned (no backhold) this coulda messed up the float setting) Some call this "flooding" but actually it's "overfilling"

Enough of that

You might also try running your mix screws in till they EVER SO LIGHTLY touch bottom (turning 'em in hard WILL DAMAGE THE CARB!)

For now, back them out 2 turns (we may move 'em to 3 turns if 2 ain't enough)

For giggles, give it a whirl!

Results?

Sending you a link to look over. For now, it's a guide for later on when we can KEEP IT RUNNING! We're not to that point yet!

Please check out the mix screw adjustments that will occur later (and why!) That will be nearer the end of the thread I'm sending.

Keep in mind, I'm using my inline 6 cylinder 258 pics ('77 CJ-5) to guide this feller with a 304 (8 cylinder). THE THEORY IS THE SAME FOR YOURS!

https://www.2carpros.com/questions/jeep-cj7-1985-jeep-cj7-stalls-when-hot

OK

Rear axles on "Willy" are tapered with a keyway

I leave my wheel on and on the ground.

I remove the dust cap, cotter pin, and castle nut

I install my CJ MEDEVAC whizzy tool


Whizzy Tool- a nut with the same threads as the castle nut, this nut is welded on the outside to a 1/4 piece of flat steel. Flat steel bends outward slightly


Run Mr. Whizzy tool down until the flat steel bottoms out on the end of the axle (this keeps the threads from giving and the axle from mushrooming)

There is/ should be about an 1/8 to a 1/4 inch gap between the whizzy nut and the hub. (No gap will not let the axle move independently of the hub-in other words it not work! Gotta have the gap!)

Wheel is on the ground!

Draw back about 3-4 feet with your sledge hammer and smack the whizzy tool directly over the nut.

Usually the 1st lick does it, every now and again a second lick may be necessary.

This breaks the taper loose from the hub.

Jack up the wheel, remove lug nuts, remove whizzy tool, remove wheel, slip the hub off.

THIS WILL NOT WORK FOR '76-'86 CJs, their axles are splined and cut their own splines in the hub.

SEE PIC 4

NOTE
Your drums are pressed onto the hubs using the wheel studs, press the studs out, they will separate. A new drum can be installed in reverse order.

Send update!

The Medic

How do I know which electronic ignition to buy for my jeep? Would it be just the a 6cyl, 12 volt?

My wife and I tried the test. I pulled the tube right out of the carb intake and had her turn it over - it filled a mason jar with about 1/2" of gas.

With regard to your question about back holding the carb inlet - I actually took it out to inspect the filter and make sure it was in there correct with the spring. It had one of those copper filters.

Interesting method you used on your wheels/hubs. I wish I would of known about this site before I spent the money on the puller, but I was so frustrated that I gave in.

The screws are both backed out two turns. Without using the choke tried to start it, but no luck. Playing with the choke, it would fire up, rev real high and then die. The choke is really hard to push in and pull out.

How fast did you get half a jar of fuel? (estimated seconds)

Choke: cable rusty?/ tight turns in the cable?/ Kinks in the cable?/ Can you take it loose at the carb, straighten the end, pull it all the way out, straighten out any kinks along the inner cable, reinstall.

Note: Most carbs require the throttle be turned and held open when pulling the choke on (with your hand, or using the accelerator pedal.)

So far, it's sounding like a carb issue (float could be stuck up or close, the bowl may not be filling to it's correct level or maybe the needle and seat are stuck, again, the bowl is not filling.

The choke may be able to vacuum the fuel to the top and it starts, when what little bit of the fuel runs out it dies. (fuel should already be towards the top of the bowl, venturi effect would make it go into the throat)
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We have not even mentioned possible vacuum leaks, have you looked for any? Know how? Do you smoke?
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Converting to Pertronics electronic ignition- need your distributor number-is there a tag on the body? Brand/ number?

I'd wait on this until it is running, as it must be running to set the timing. I will look for it using the info you find so it can be obtained.

Shoot me a few pics of the engine, remove the air cleaner so I can see better.

The Medic

The fuel went into the jar immediately, so 1 second.

I bought a vacuum gauge, but need guidance on checking for leaks. I unscrewed the top of the carb to inspect the float - seemed to freely move and was level. I left it unscrewed until I hear from you as I don't really know what else to look for. I didn't take the top of the carb off completely as am afraid I won't be able to get the choke back on right. I did notice a crack in the gasket between the top and bottom of the carb - doesn't seem bad enough to cause an issue, but wanted to mention it.

Can you touch the float?

Will it move downward freely?

1st try- push it ever so slowly, did if feel like it was sorta stuck/ or binding in the up position?

Like how fast does it run? Like wide open or a high idle?

How long does it run before it dies?

This has a mechanical fuel pump and not a 'lectric one?

Are any ports on the carb missing hoses or not being capped off?

Same for the intake manifold, anything left open?

Hoses- any Tees and or hoses open to open air?

The Medic

Can you touch the float? yes

Will it move downward freely? it does

1st try- push it ever so slowly, did if feel like it was sorta stuck/ or binding in the up position? No but when it first drops I here a little click like it is hitting something-it is at the very beginning of it dropping

Like how fast does it run? Like wide open or a high idle? wide open

How long does it run before it dies?2-5 seconds

This has a mechanical fuel pump and not a 'lectric one? yes, mechanical and it is new

Are any ports on the carb missing hoses or not being capped off? No

Same for the intake manifold, anything left open? Only where the air filter hose attaches

Hoses- any Tees and or hoses open to open air?Not that I can see

When you snatched the carb top off, was there fuel in the bowl?

Did you get the choke to move more freely?

When you nursed to keep it running for 30 seconds, was it running wide open like when you made it run on it's own for 2-5 seconds?

After you reassemble the carb, (ready to go)

Send me another pic of it, as close to the same shot/ position as you sent with the last pic.

Sorry I'm not performing a miracle real fast here, hands on is so much EZer. You don't live right down the road from me here in South Carolina, do ya?!

The Medic

When you snatched the carb top off, was there fuel in the bowl?

- Assuming the float bowl, it was empty, but you could tell there had been fuel in there

Did you get the choke to move more freely?

- No-I pulled it out and it is jacked up. I am going to try to order a new one - will keep you posted

When you nursed to keep it running for 30 seconds, was it running wide open like when you made it run on it's own for 2-5 seconds?

- It ran wide open the whole time

After you reassemble the carb, (ready to go)

- It is reassembled, but without the choke

Send me another pic of it, as close to the same shot/ position as you sent with the last pic.

Sorry I'm not performing a miracle real fast here, hands on is so much EZer. You don't live right down the road from me here in South Carolina, do ya!

- You don't need to be - I appreciate your help more than you can imagine. I enjoy your reply's and try to anticipate what we will do next. I wouldn't mind living in SC after 46 years in CO, I could move easily.

Thanks again for all your help!

Matt

I already ordered the choke assembly. Sorry about the duplicate pics-not sure why that is happening.

In general, with the tests we have done, do you think the engine is OK? I am kind of waiting on ordering the brakes until I know for sure.

Upside down makes it all fun!

I'm slowly working on you!

Here's my latest masterpiece, you probably already knew this.

See "right side up" pic below

The Medic

Geez-had no idea they were upside down - sorry about that. The square with the little black screw is loose and fell back a little when I removed the choke cable. The other part is bent for sure but is not the problem with the choke-even after I pulled it out, it had a problem. In the middle of the cable there something wrong causing it to not move freely. Do we need to wait for the new cable or can we try just manually messing with the choke until I get the cable. What can I try next?

I reckon you understand that as the choke progressively closes, the linkage on the side "CAMS" the idle screw more open. Thus, higher RPMs as the choke closes.

Hard to adjust stuff with it not running.

After we do get it going, when the choke is completely off (standing at attention), The idle screw will be adjusted to the correct idle speed. Then it will, per say, be calibrated to the choke cam.

Right now you can back it off some if you wish.

The concern at the moment is little or no fuel in the bowl.

Just for giggles, do you wanna install a clear plastic (throw away) fuel filter into the rubber line just before the carb. Then remove the gold nugget lookin' filter out of the carb.

Give it a whirl? Will it run?

And it could be a float/ needle/ seat issue- We'll get there

Carb got a warranty?

Before, I asked if you smoked.

I was sorta getting at blowing smoke into the PCV hose (PCV removed), with a wet rag sorta sealing off the whole top of the carb. OR have a buddy do it. If you do have a vacuum leak your helper might spot it. Not the best-us way to find a leak. It'll do to find something major, better ways once it's running. Just a thought.

The Medic

I have the clear fuel filter and will give it a try tonight. Sorry-I missed your smoking question. My answer to you is I live in Colorado where certain things are legal. I don't smoke cigarettes though.

I was referring to tobacco, no need on getting your Jeep hooked on the other crap.

You have a sick Jeep, I don't think the medicinal crap is the answer.

Nor do we need to add sluggishness, being giddy, craving more fuel, or Jeeping under the influence to the scenario.

The more symptoms you throw in, the harder it might be to diagnose!

LOL!

Any good results yet?

Been out shopping with/ and for the wifey, She now has a 2016 Jeep Compass w/ 34,517 miles on it.

The Medic

Sorry I have been out with the flu. I exchanged the carburetor for a new one and am waiting on that. I also never hit enter when I order the choke, so I ordered that today also.

I'm always here, usually every night 7PM till 11PM Eastern give or take.

Today we did honey-dos.

Unpacking and installing her Christmas stuff.

I rolled Willy out of the garage so he could sun bathe his new coating on. Gotta cure out a little more before I can reinstall his insignia back on. He sorta has that naked look about him now.

The Medic

That is a very cool looking jeep.

Any ideas where I might find a new oil pan for a 67 cj5 v6 - I have looked everywhere...

I went to several sites (including Kaiser Willys)

I went to Ebay- looked up "Buick 225 oil pan"

Bunches of high tech/ high dollar ones.

I found the one below.

I made a screenshot.

Does it look (really look!) like your design?

Find this in Ebay, they may show specs when you click on it.

The Medic

Thank you - it does look close to my design. I will check into it.

Happy New Year! I finally have the two carb mounted. It took forever to get the carb swapped out and it has been too cold in my garage to work on anything. Had a couple of nice days now and am close to having it ready. I do have one issue. When mounting the choke cable off the side of the carb -is the outer jacket of the choke cable suppose to be completely secured in the bracket so it doesn't move or should it be able to slide? I can't remember when I took the old one off if it was loose or not.

Thank you!

Sorry when I say two carb, I mean new carb

I'm so glad to hear from you!

I reckon the rest of the CJs out there are not having any issues. Kinda feel like the Maytag Man.

Had a cold spell here too. Willy is still waiting to have his insignia put on, I refuse to drive him neck-ed like that, maybe next week end I can get it done.

This the way I had to secure the choke cable for my Holley on "Mr. Jeep". (1st two pics below) Looking at both of my pics, that was the only suitable anchor point I had (I kinda didn't want to take an intake/ exhaust bolt out to get it closer). Yours will probably be much-much shorter.

One of these years I'll replace the flimsy bracket that came in the kit with something a bit stiffer, Might even make the new/ homemade one with an Arm that will get me closer to the choke.

I could only secure mine a little further from the choke than I really wanted to with what was on hand.

I kept the outer shroud sorta long past the anchor. Anchor your shroud, it should not move!

IF I had chopped it shorter, the Inner Cable/ Wire would be Really long, that INVITES the inner cable/ wire to fold over/ bend a lot/ or flex if there ever was a slight bind, which would inevitably not let the choke axle have full travel.

Moral of story: Keep the outer shroud as long as possible without it interfering with full Needed travel of the inner cable/ wire.

Let's see some progression pics!

(last two pics are of "Willy's" painted interior)

The Medic

I will send some pics when I get the new choke - I accidentally cut the wire too short. Also been too cold to work on it.

I hate the cold too!

Can't think well or operate when you shiver!

We don't wanna make any mistakes on the Best vehicle ever designed.

Still too cold for me to decal "Willy", I've been piddling here and there on other things he needs.

I'll be right here waiting for you when you are ready to continue.

The Medic