Starting and run problem

Tiny
KENTON.STROOP
  • MEMBER
  • 1993 VOLKSWAGEN EUROVAN
  • 2.5L
  • 5 CYL
  • 2WD
  • AUTOMATIC
  • 95,000 MILES
I've have had several coil failures. Currently it will try to fire/start but will fail to stay running and smells like it had flooded (light gray smoke from exhaust). It may take several attempts and when it does start, it may not stay running. It seems to always start normally when cold. AutoZone has ordered me a HEI coil, it was listed as one of the options for this vehicle. I haven't read anything describing this van having a HEI in my Bentley repair manuals. I've sent the ECM in for a test and check, and was found to have no problems. The alternator is providing 14.45 volts per specs.

Plugs and wires are relatively new and show no signs of problems. Voltage regulator is also quit new and is putting out correct voltage each time I check.
Saturday, December 22nd, 2018 AT 10:38 AM

21 Replies

Tiny
KEN L
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The coil failures are troublesome. Can you check the main ground from the engine block to the frame please? Also check the ground at the battery to the frame. Please report back.
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Monday, December 24th, 2018 AT 1:24 PM
Tiny
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I'll need to get back with you after Christmas. It's hard to see connections with out removing the lower pan and opening the engine space. That would make since if it is intermittently making good contact, just odd the way it behaves. Why does it always start when cold. It does have a cold start valve, but it doesn't seem to have any effect when I disable it at temperature. I haven't had any coils fail as of late, but it will just shutdown while driving, may or may not restart right away. It may run really well or run rough which could be consistent with a poor ground. I might have to add my own grounding cable. Thank you for your time, I'll get back with you.
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Monday, December 24th, 2018 AT 3:46 PM
Tiny
KEN L
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A connection problem will make the circuit stop causing the engine to stall. Go grounds first and we can go from there. Please let me know.
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Tuesday, December 25th, 2018 AT 2:32 PM
Tiny
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I checked the ground resistance from battery to block, battery to body, body to block with zero resistance. I’ve checked the ground cables both visually and physically for corrosion and security, and found no deficiencies. The van ran well today, but I had intermittent tachometer failures for the first time ever, with no indication of other malfunctions. The tachometer is an integrated in the instrument panel, and no other readings were affected. (On my 1969 Mustang I would attribute this to a coil and or a connection problem being that it is an aftermarket tachometer I installed. Two wires which I can see.) There are three other ground leads/wires, besides the main cable, at the battery positive post. There is no way to follow those leads. I only know one lead goes into the cab somewhere.

Well, I spoke too soon, just took the van out to the beach. I had more tachometer erratic failures, but with momentary engine interruptions at the same time. When I sensed engine failures this time, I downshifted “which appeared to help” keep the engine running. Keep it in second gear, 5,000 rpm, to get me home. Ran well while at idle in the driveway! What do you think about an alternator failing?
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Wednesday, December 26th, 2018 AT 11:46 AM
Tiny
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I need to proof read better.
There are three other ground leads/wires, besides the main cable, at the battery "negative" post.
Well, I "spoke" too soon, just took the van out to the beach.
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Wednesday, December 26th, 2018 AT 3:04 PM
Tiny
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FYI, per my wiring diagram: There is a sensor (Camshaft Position, CMP Sensor) which provides input to/from/to the ECM and the Ignition Coil Power Output Stage that provides power to the Ignition Coil. (The Ignition Coil Power Output Stage "I think" is the base of the coil assembly, which I believe is where the failure is in the coils) The CMP also has input to the Distributor Rotor.
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Thursday, December 27th, 2018 AT 3:38 AM
Tiny
KEN L
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Yes, it sounds like the hall effect sensor inside the distributor is going out which they had trouble with. Here is the location of the sensor and how the ignition system works on this car below.

Check out the diagrams (below). Please let us know what you find. We are interested to see what it is.
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Thursday, December 27th, 2018 AT 5:13 PM
Tiny
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It took "some searching", but I found some on Ebay under the description (Distributor Ignition Pickup, $56-$101). I don’t expect to get it until about Jan. 5th 2019. Pending on the weather, how quickly I get around to installing it. I’ll get back to you then.
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Friday, December 28th, 2018 AT 11:58 AM
Tiny
KEN L
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Please do
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Saturday, December 29th, 2018 AT 10:53 AM
Tiny
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I'm not sure that the compatibility chart correctly identified this part to my vehicle. It would put this pickup at 180 degrees out of rotation for a five cylinder engine. I can see, that if you have an "even number" of cylinders that the way the distributor cam is designed that could work. But with an odd number of cylinders that doesn't seem possible. Can you verify or confirm? However the new pickup looks like the same "pickup" as shown in the parts breakdown in your image and in my manual. I put the new pickup in and it would not start, although it did fire in a cylinder or two. So I put the old one in and it started and ran well until is stalled and wouldn't restart until the engine cooled for several hours.
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Saturday, January 5th, 2019 AT 2:41 AM
Tiny
KEN L
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It sounds like you have a distributor for a four cylinder? Can you upload a picture of the reluctor inside the distributor?
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Saturday, January 5th, 2019 AT 11:29 AM
Tiny
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I'm not familiar with the nomenclature reluctor. Could you describe it for me?
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Saturday, January 5th, 2019 AT 12:12 PM
Tiny
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Well, I got the truck to run with the new ignition pickup. However, I had to shift the distributor housing about 20 deg.” Counter clockwise”. The problem now is, I have no way to secure the distributor housing to the block. The adjustment slots in the housing no longer line up to the taps in the block for the locking bolts. So the timing can change or the distributor could just fall out. It only needs to slide out about a quarter inch to disengage with the cam.
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Sunday, January 6th, 2019 AT 1:14 PM
Tiny
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So, I started the truck and let it idle for thirty minutes without incident (idle rpm increase excessively with temperature). And, I could not accelerate the engine with out it stalling. The advance doesn't work correctly. I tried minor adjustments without effect.

Pictures show the original Hall Effect Sensor/CMP, with reluctor at center.
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Monday, January 7th, 2019 AT 8:57 AM
Tiny
KEN L
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Yep, that is a five cylinder. Does the new unit have four cut outs in the reluctor? I have seen the engine coolant temperature sensor cause issue like you are describing as well. Can you unplug it to see if the symptoms change?

Check out the diagrams (below). Please let us know what happens.
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Monday, January 7th, 2019 AT 10:50 AM
Tiny
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The new sensor didn't come with a new reluctor, I'm using the original shown in the photo.
I did a new search on eBay using Hall Effect Sensor vice a CMP for my model and year and came up with a sensor that looks like my original and is "also" listed as compatible with my vehicle. I should expect it on Jan. 15.

EBay, Throttle Position Sensor Walker Products 200-1312 fits 1993 VW EuroVan 2.5L-L5
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Monday, January 7th, 2019 AT 11:14 AM
Tiny
KEN L
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Okay, please let me know what happens.
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Monday, January 7th, 2019 AT 11:35 AM
Tiny
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Just FYI, The Throttle Position Sensor "is not" the right part! However I found a Distributor Impulse Transmitter Kit BOSCH 1237031296 that is correct however, it looks exactly like the old one, but when I install it, the reluctor will not pass through the pickup slot. The rotor will not rotate without damaging the transmitter as it is. It is only off a fraction, maybe.01 inch. Waiting for a response form the seller to get back with me!

I had given up on finding the correct part under the nomenclatures I was using, and decide to look up a complete distributor, and while scrolling through the offerings this transmitter kit came up.
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Monday, January 14th, 2019 AT 1:30 PM
Tiny
KEN L
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I was going to suggest a complete distributor. Let me know what happens.
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Tuesday, January 15th, 2019 AT 10:30 AM
Tiny
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Happy Day, the new distributor works so far, well, at least for more than just a few miles. Ironically I found a new distributor at about a third of the cost ($38) of Distributor Ignition Pickup/Hall Effect Sensors that fortunately I was able to return. The truck “should have” another 60 to 80,000 miles. I’m going to get an extra distributor and keep it in the truck with a 5mm allen wrench, a 10mm socket and a coil ( it's an easy fix). Thanks for your help. Hope your day goes well.
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Thursday, January 24th, 2019 AT 8:23 AM

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