Radiator cooling fans are not working?

Tiny
MBUCH425
  • MEMBER
  • 1991 CHEVROLET LUMINA
  • 3.1L
  • 2WD
  • AUTOMATIC
  • 115,000 MILES
Neither fan works, not even the passenger side with A/C on. The dash temperature gauge works and shows the engine getting hotter in stop-n-go traffic. At its worst, it once hit 200-220. The fuse is good. Both relays test okay, and the relay sockets have power. I can't get the wiring harness off either fan motor to test there or power to a motor directly.
Tuesday, April 18th, 2023 AT 7:20 PM

5 Replies

Tiny
JACOBANDNICKOLAS
  • MECHANIC
  • 109,700 POSTS
Hi,

What is preventing the fan connectors from being disconnected? Are they damaged? As far as the fan motors are concerned, as you mentioned, we need to confirm there is power and ground available to them. Or we need to apply battery voltage directly to them to see if they run. Either of the checks will require the connector to be unplugged.

Explain to me what is happening at the connectors. Also, the thermostat doesn't fully open until it reaches 195 degrees F. If it is at 200 degrees, that isn't a concern. 220 is pushing it.

If you disconnect the temperature sensor for the fan motors, I believe they should turn on. You can try that as well. The sensor is located below the coolant outlet. See pic below

Let me know.

Joe

See pic below.
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Wednesday, April 19th, 2023 AT 7:16 PM
Tiny
MBUCH425
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  • 3 POSTS
First and most importantly, thank you Joe for trying to help out!

The connections from the wiring harness are direct to the fan, right at the bottom of the fans, and very short out of the bundled harness. I even unbolted a fan and tried to rotate it so that I could see the connection. No go. The wiring is too short to allow that. I've pushed and pulled every which way, but without seeing the fitting or knowing exactly how to disengage it, I don't want to force it for fear of breaking the fitting. I have enough problems already, right?

I can add that the fans have not worked for months and months, but only after my last effort at diagnosing (checking the relays and such) did the car start showing a check engine light on the dash, after it has warmed up a tiny bit. I tried getting a reading of a code at a car parts store, but their computer would not hook up. Square peg in a round hole sort of issue - my socket under the dash has square edges and their plug was rounded off!

There has been a 'low coolant' warning light on the dash intermittently. As in it doesn't always come on (hasn't in a long while actually), and only blinks on-n-off when it does. I've checked the coolant many times and it's never low. That might be a dirty sensor at the bottom of the reserve tank, but that involves removing hoses and the entire tank (plus more) just to get to it, so I haven't bothered.

That does not look like the right diagram for my engine - a 3.1 L Multiport FI (or is it F1?). At least that's what it says on the top of it. In the front, I have the ignition "distributor" down low, with the intake manifold above that, followed by the front three spark plugs above that (remember, front wheel drive, transverse engine). The oil dip stick is not fully visible like in the drawing and is actually more toward the driver's side. The hose from the radiator on the passenger side goes to the water pump, which sits at the top, front portion of the serpentine belt. The other hose goes to the top of the engine on the driver's side.

The thermostat is buried behind a manifold on the driver's side and requires partial disassembly just to get a glimpse of it, plus a special twisted wrench to fit behind the manifold to actually take it off. So obviously, I haven't gotten down to that! I've seen reference, but never a drawing, that the temperature sensor is near the thermostat. Even after taking off the air filter box, I can't see anything that I can definitely say must be the sensor though.

As for temps, according to the dash gauge, the car normally runs around 120. In stop-n-go, it will easily rise to 140ish. I keep the defroster running full bore with windows down to help cool. It very rarely approaches 180, and as I said, last summer during the worst incident (which was the occasion that alerted me to a problem) it got to around 220. But again, the defroster trick helped bring that down. But I'm in Seattle where air temperatures are still in 40s or maybe 50s.

I'm stumped about what to try next for diagnosing, so any thoughts are most welcome!
Mike
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Saturday, April 22nd, 2023 AT 10:57 PM
Tiny
JACOBANDNICKOLAS
  • MECHANIC
  • 109,700 POSTS
Hi,

The parts stores have OBD2 scanners. They won't work with your vehicle. Your vehicle is designed with an OBD1 system. It doesn't require a scan tool to retrieve codes. All you need is a short jumper wire or even a paper clip.

Follow the directions in this link and let me know what you find:

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/buick-cadillac-chevy-gmc-oldsmobile-pontiac-gm-1983-1995-obd1-code-definitions-and-retrieval-method

Let me know if that helps.

Take care,

Joe
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Sunday, April 23rd, 2023 AT 6:37 PM
Tiny
MBUCH425
  • MEMBER
  • 3 POSTS
I thought I had posted a whole long reply some time ago and I finally was checking back. Oh well? The very short digest: checked right after a hot commute home. With the ODB jumper in, the fans actually did work, so their motors are fine. The minute I pulled the jumper, they quit. The code was 13.
It's been suggested I just hot-wire the motors, use a dash switch and/or pull from an ignition on circuit. Any risks to that approach?
Mike
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Tuesday, June 6th, 2023 AT 10:51 PM
Tiny
JACOBANDNICKOLAS
  • MECHANIC
  • 109,700 POSTS
Hi,

I've heard of a lot of people doing a switch. It will work but make sure you have a heavy enough gauge wire, switch, and you fuse it.

Also, the code is related to an oxygen sensor. I attached the diagnostics below for it.

As far as the relay, if the fans work when it is jumped and the relay is good, I suspect it is related to the primary side not getting a ground to complete the circuit.

Let me know if I can help.

Joe
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Wednesday, June 7th, 2023 AT 6:37 PM

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