Long Term fuel trim value?

Tiny
ALSCAMRY
  • MEMBER
  • 2005 TOYOTA CAMRY
  • 2.4L
  • 4 CYL
  • 2WD
  • AUTOMATIC
  • 150,000 MILES
Using a scanner, I see that I have a high long term fuel trim number - 25%. From my research it seems this should be about 10%. At present I do not have any trouble codes.

Here is what I have done so far. After each action I monitored long term fuel trim for changes while engine is at idle.

1) Checked and cleaned PCV valve - it rattles when I shake it.
2) Removed and plugged EVAP purge hose.
3) Removed and plugged brake booster hose.
4) Clean MAF sensor (MAF wires and Intake temperature thermistor).
5) Cleaned throttle body.
6) Checked for vacuum leaks - valve cover, intake manifold and hoses. Used brake clean and water squirter.

I have run the engine to 3,000-4,000 RPMs for 10-15 seconds and I see long term fuel trim go down below 10%, which points to vacuum leak but not successful in locating it.

Any ideas? Fuel delivery seems okay when I go WOT but have not pressure tested pump or cleaned injectors.

BTW, I can send you pdf of scan tool output of parameters if it helps.
Saturday, December 30th, 2023 AT 12:18 PM

6 Replies

Tiny
KEN L
  • MASTER CERTIFIED MECHANIC
  • 47,624 POSTS
If you can upload an image of the readings that would be great, but from experience I can tell you once the MAF sensor has gone bad for too long cleaning it will not help. I would replace it with a new sensor. This is a main reason for negative number fuel trims. Here is the location of the sensor to make sure we are on the same page. Check out the images (below). Please let us know what happens.
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Saturday, December 30th, 2023 AT 1:02 PM
Tiny
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Here is the scan data. MAF looks reasonable to me. AF numbers are switching fine.
Maybe I am missing a vacuum leak somewhere? Any suggestions other than smoke
machine?

I looked at factory manual and it seems to indicate that +-30% Long term FT is
OK, but maybe I am not reading it right, although I have run the car for a week and no MIL light so far.

Calculated Load 14.50%
Coolant Temperature 190.4 deg F
Short Fuel Trim #1 0.74%
Long Fuel Trim #1 23.39%
Engine Speed 675 rpm
Vehicle Speed 0 mph
Ignition Advance 8.5 deg
Intake Air 86.0 deg F
MAF 2.51 gm/s
Throttle Position 15%
Oxygen Sensor (O2S) Bank 1 Sensor 2 0.855 V
AF Fuel Trim Bank 1 Sensor 1 0.99
AFS Bank 1 Sensor 1 3.24 V
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Wednesday, January 3rd, 2024 AT 12:20 PM
Tiny
KEN L
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MAF 2.51 gm/s looks low to me, I would check for a vacuum leak, but the long-term trim numbers indicate there is a rich condition which can be a fuel injector becoming clogged and the spray pattern is not correct. Please check for a vacuum leak as well. This guide can help if you don't have a smoke machine. Use it on the engine when it is cold only.

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/how-to-use-an-engine-vacuum-gauge

Please go over this guide and get back to us. If all is okay, try a new MAF sensor.

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Thursday, January 4th, 2024 AT 7:40 AM
Tiny
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Okay, thanks for all the info. New MAF is coming soon and will try that 1st since it is so easy to swap out. While reading I see that EGR could cause a lean condition. I looked high and low on my 2005 Camry but could not locate it (earlier models have them). If you have a diagram of its location I would appreciate it. Thanks again.
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Thursday, January 4th, 2024 AT 12:27 PM
Tiny
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Installed new non-OEM MAF sensor and LT fuel trim jumped to 40! So re-cleaned and replaced original MAF. Sprayed carb cleaner around top of intake runners and throttle body to recheck but no change. Also sprayed around those funny tubes above the throttle body and around PCV valve. Reved engine over 3K and did see fuel come down 5-10%. Maybe I have to check fuel pressure or make a DIY smoke machine.
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Thursday, January 4th, 2024 AT 6:53 PM
Tiny
KEN L
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You might need to drive it with the new MAF sensor so the PCM can relearn. Checking the fuel pressure is a good idea, but you may have a fuel injector that is partially clogged. It might be a good idea to pull the spark plug to compare the color, if you have one that is black or dark color, we found the cylinder having the problem.

Please go over this guide to help check the fuel pressure:

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/how-to-check-fuel-system-pressure-and-regulator

Fuel pressure (From July 2003)
At Idle .................... 304 - 343 kPa (3.1 - 3.5 kgf/sq.cm, 44 - 50 psi)
After Engine Stopped for 5 Min. .................... 147 kPa (1.5 kgf/sq.cm, 21psi)

Please go over this guide and get back to us.
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Friday, January 5th, 2024 AT 9:50 AM

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