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Traction control light coming on

Tiny
PUCK4HIGGS
  • MEMBER
  • 2006 PONTIAC GRAND PRIX
  • 5.3L
  • V8
  • 2WD
  • AUTOMATIC
  • 145,000 MILES
I installed a Intermediate Steering Shaft in my car listed above GXP. I did not remove anything to do it except the rubber throttle body intake hose and air filter. I also removed the master cylinder off of the booster but did not remove any lines, just moved it up away so the I could get my arm down there to remove the knuckle off of the top of the rack and pinion. After I completed the install and put everything back together I reset the battery connection. The traction control and Stability System Service comes on when I move the car. Those lights don't come on until I move the car and they go away when the car is turned off. They only come on when the car moves. And keep in mind these lights were not around before I did the ISS replacement. I got back in to the area I was working during the install and there are no connectors or wires that look like a problem.
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Friday, November 22nd, 2019 AT 3:23 PM

13 Replies

Tiny
JACOBANDNICKOLAS
  • MECHANIC
  • 109,885 POSTS
Hi,

There is a brake fluid level sensor on the master cylinder. Double check that it is fully connected. If the vehicle thinks it's low on brake fluid, these lights will come on. I attached a pic of the sensor I'm questioning. Make sure no wiring was damaged to it as well.

Let me know.

Joe
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Friday, November 22nd, 2019 AT 9:57 PM
Tiny
PUCK4HIGGS
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I did remove that connector because it was tight when I moved the cylinder up away. I will check it to make sure I didn't buggar it up. However, if that was the problem why wouldn't it show the light right when I fired up the car? And why does the light only come on when I move the car. Then when the car is shut off the light goes away. When you fire it up again it's gone, until you move. Also my wife took it down to AutoZone while I was at the fire station and they tried to read the codes and they said there weren't any because there isn't a check engine light. Could there be something related to me messing around with the master cylinder? Baffled here.
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Monday, November 25th, 2019 AT 7:43 AM
Tiny
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Okay, here is what I did: I checked the connector and wiring which I believe to good. I verified by shorting the connector with a paper clip and it immediately gave me a low brake fluid alarm. I am almost thinking the switch and connector in the master must be okay also because I'm not seeing a low fluid alarm when it is plugged in. Although that connector on the master cylinder sure seems cheesy. So IDK. Unless it's possible for the switch in the cylinder to be bad and not show a low fluid alarm. The other thing that struck me was with the low fluid alarm active the T/C light still did not come on until I moved the car. Something is happening to the system to shut off the Stability System when the car is moving. It hasn't done this before until I put that ISS in and I can't get a correlation between the two.
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Monday, November 25th, 2019 AT 8:32 AM
Tiny
JACOBANDNICKOLAS
  • MECHANIC
  • 109,885 POSTS
Anything is possible. On most GM vehicles, the ABS does a self check when the vehicle starts to move. That is most likely why you are getting the light after you start driving.

As far as there being no codes, it's most likely because their scanner can not read ABS codes. Something has caused the ABS to fail. As a result, the stability control is affected.

Because of where you were working, I need you to check both the connection and wiring to the EBCM (electronic brake control module). I attached a pic of it and feel you will recognize the part. It is under the hood near the master cylinder.

Let me know.

Joe
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Monday, November 25th, 2019 AT 6:58 PM
Tiny
PUCK4HIGGS
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I checked that connection and it is solid. It is hard to even get to. The wiring and connector are in good shape.
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Tuesday, November 26th, 2019 AT 7:44 AM
Tiny
PUCK4HIGGS
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I finally figured it out with some help from some old Pontiac dealer mechanics and a scanner. I messed up when I was putting the new ISS in. I let the steering wheel slam hard in one direction. I forgot that had happened. The code that is being seen and can't be cleared is a C0710, Steering Position Signal. I messed up the Steering Angle Signal sensor. So I get to take the ISS back off the steering column end and put a new sensor on. Ouch! Replace one thing and mess up another. Oh well, live and learn. Thanks anyway Joe, you were the only one that even tried. I appreciate your effort.
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Tuesday, November 26th, 2019 AT 3:31 PM
Tiny
JACOBANDNICKOLAS
  • MECHANIC
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Hi,

You are very welcome. I'm glad you got it figured out. I don't know if you need them, but here are the directions for replacing that sensor. And, yes, it is directly tied into the EBCM. The attached pics correlate with the directions.

__________________________________________

2006 Pontiac Grand Prix V8-5.3L VIN C
Steering Wheel Position Sensor or Steering Shaft Lower Bearing Replacement
Vehicle Steering and Suspension Steering Sensors and Switches - Steering Steering Angle Sensor Service and Repair Procedures Steering Wheel Position Sensor or Steering Shaft Lower Bearing Replacement
STEERING WHEEL POSITION SENSOR OR STEERING SHAFT LOWER BEARING REPLACEMENT
Steering Wheel Position Sensor or Steering Shaft Lower Bearing Replacement

Removal Procedure

pic 1

Caution: Refer to SIR Caution in Service Precautions.

1. Disable the SIR system.
2. Remove the steering column from the vehicle.
3. Remove the following from the steering shaft:
1. Steering shaft seal (1)
2. Sensor retainer (2)
3. Steering wheel position sensor (3).

Pic 2

4. Remove the following from the steering shaft:
1. Lower spring retainer (1)
2. Lower bearing spring (2)
3. Lower bearing seat (3)
4. Adapter and bearing assembly (4)

Installation Procedure

pic 3

1. Install the following onto the steering shaft:
Adapter and bearing assembly (4)

Important: The lower bearing seat must be in contact with the adapter and bearing assembly.

2. Lower bearing seat (3)
Lower bearing spring (2)
Lower spring retainer (1)

pic 4

3. Install the steering wheel position sensor (1).

Important: Align the slots of the sensor retainer (1) to the ribs of the adapter and bearing assembly. Push the sensor retainer (1) until it contacts the steering wheel position sensor.

Pic 5

4. Install the sensor retainer (1).
5. Install the steering shaft seal (2).
6. Install the steering column to the vehicle.
7. Enable the SIR system.

____________________________________________________________________

Let me know if this helps and how you make out.

Take care and have a good Thanksgiving.

Joe
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Tuesday, November 26th, 2019 AT 5:13 PM
Tiny
PUCK4HIGGS
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Hey, one more thing. I had a dream last night about this darn thing. When we were scanning the car, the scanner said that the steering wheel was at 360 degrees when it was straight. The mechanic said it should be reading 0 degrees. I am wondering if when my steering wheel took off on me when I was connecting the upper end of the ISS, with the battery connected, if when I finally hooked it up I was a full steering wheel rotation away from 0 and the damn thing thinks its a full turn out of alignment. So my thought is before I spend $170 on a sensor if it wouldn't pay to carefully pull the ISS off the the steering shaft and rotate the steering wheel what the sensor thinks is back to zero and reconnect the ISS. Could it be that simple? I'm doubtful because the scanner couldn't reset the calibration, but you never know. Without the ISS connected that steering wheel can go around and around and you would have a fifty fifty chance of hitting 0 degrees. If that's how it works. Just a thought in the middle of the night. Thoughts! Oh and thanks for the instructions, I don't however see where the pictures are.

Mike Higgs
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Wednesday, November 27th, 2019 AT 10:09 AM
Tiny
JACOBANDNICKOLAS
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Hi,

It wouldn't hurt to try. I looked up the centering. Take a look through these directions to confirm you did it the same way,

Steering Wheel Position Sensor Centering

Steering Angle Sensor Centering Procedure
The steering angle sensor does not require centering often. Centering of the steering angle sensor might be required after certain service procedures are performed. Some of these procedures are as follows:
Steering gear replacement
Steering column replacement
Steering angle sensor replacement
Intermediate shaft replacement
ABS controller replacement
Collision or other physical damage
Engine cradle replacement

The steering angle sensor centering procedure can be preformed with a scan tool in the automated center procedure by the following:

1. Using the steering wheel, align the front wheels forward.
2. Set the transmission in the park position.
3. Install the scan tool to the DLC.
4. Turn the ignition switch ON, with the engine OFF.
5. Select ABS/TCS/VSES, special function out put test, and automated centering procedure.
6. Follow the scan tool directions to complete the automated centering procedure.
7. Clear any DTCs that may be set, perform the Diagnostic System Check to verify no current DTCs. Refer to Diagnostic System Check - Vehicle.
8. Centering of the steering angle sensor is complete.

__________________________________________________________________

Also, I am so sorry about the pics. I forgot to attach them. I got it this time.

Take care and have a good Thanksgiving.

Joe
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Wednesday, November 27th, 2019 AT 8:17 PM
Tiny
PUCK4HIGGS
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Well, I disconnected the ISS from the steering column and rotated the steering wheel back one full rotation. Put it all back together and now the T/C light comes on the second I start it. And it doesn't reset when I turn off the car. Now I have a permanent light. Not sure what that means if anything. I also wonder now if the scanner would read zero at center instead of 360. And if so, would the scanner be able to reset it now. Anyway, that's where I am now. I still haven't conceded to replacing the position sensor but I may be getting pushed into a corner.
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Monday, December 2nd, 2019 AT 1:22 PM
Tiny
JACOBANDNICKOLAS
  • MECHANIC
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The only thing you can do is try to see if it resets. However, like you, I feel it may be time to replace the sensor.
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Monday, December 2nd, 2019 AT 6:01 PM
Tiny
PUCK4HIGGS
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I'll be dipped. I went down to my buddy at the old Pontiac dealer that is now a Subaru dealer and he let me borrow his old scanner and I went through the reset like you spelled out. Boom, done. All is well and no more errors. Can't thank you enough. On to the next thing.
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Tuesday, December 3rd, 2019 AT 12:44 PM
Tiny
JACOBANDNICKOLAS
  • MECHANIC
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Excellent! Wow, anything to make things a bit more difficult. LOL Regardless, I'm glad you got it taken care of.

Feel free to come back anytime. If we don't hear from you (and I know that is a good thing for you) LOL have a great holiday season.

Take care,
Joe
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Tuesday, December 3rd, 2019 AT 7:02 PM

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