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Clutch not working?

Tiny
TY KEITH
  • MEMBER
  • 2004 MAZDA RX8
  • 2WD
  • MANUAL
  • 150,000 MILES
I have changed slave and master cylinder 3 times it is not the problem. I don’t know where else to look. I changed from OEM flywheel to lightened flywheel off eBay with new clutch and pressure plate and the clutch was not right as soon as I drove it out shop. It was very light but it would allow me to shift gears. Now I cannot even shift to any gear unless car is turned off. It was drivable for about 3 days. However the clutch pedal was light but not really sticking now it will not go into gear.
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Monday, September 14th, 2020 AT 7:06 PM

25 Replies

Tiny
JACOBANDNICKOLAS
  • MECHANIC
  • 109,645 POSTS
Hi,

Are you able to see the slave working? If you haven't checked, have a helper operate the clutch pedal while you watch to see if it is moving the release lever.

See attached pic.

Let me know.
Joe
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Monday, September 14th, 2020 AT 7:43 PM
Tiny
TY KEITH
  • MEMBER
  • 24 POSTS
  • 2004 MAZDA RX8
  • 2WD
  • MANUAL
  • 150,000 MILES
My clutch was slipping but my pressure was fine. Then I took my car to a shop to have my clutch replaced along with the flywheel and slave cylinder. I bought an aftermarket flywheel off eBay (I probably shouldn’t have but they were cheaper ) so a week later my mechanic calls me and tells me it’s installed but he can’t get no pressure in the clutch. At this point the car is drivable with a very light clutch. So he said he’s bled the heck out of it and we even changed the slave cylinder again and the master twice ! Same results. Soft pedal after about three days driving it thinking maybe it just needs to be broke in now it won’t shift into any gear an all and clutch pedal is way lighter it sticks to the floor at times now. No matter how many times I pump clutch pedal it builds no pressure and makes no diffidence. I’m stumped. However upon reading the eBay listing of the flywheel I bought from it says external balance weight required. So I’m sure since I didn’t order that with the flywheel to give to my mechanic it probably wasn’t installed. Would this be the cause for any pressure problem though?
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Sunday, September 20th, 2020 AT 2:20 PM (Merged)
Tiny
TY KEITH
  • MEMBER
  • 24 POSTS
Correction it says "external balance weight required". Not counter weight.
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Sunday, September 20th, 2020 AT 2:20 PM (Merged)
Tiny
MOTOR MASTER
  • MECHANIC
  • 279 POSTS
Hello my name is Dave.

The weight shouldn't effect the pedal, I have know quite a few mechanics that have had major issues getting some clutches properly bled. I have a method that is nearly fool proof:

Purchase several feet of 3/16 hose, can be vacuum or washer, either will work fine. Slide one end over the end of the bleeder on the slave cylinder, take the lid off of the master cylinder, make sure it is full (not over full) then stick the other end as far into the fluid as you can. Open the bleeder and have an assistant pump the clutch pedal slowly, making sure to get full travel. While the pedal is being pumped you should see bubbles, when it stops bubbling have them hold the pedal to the floor and close the bleeder. Remove the hose, fill the master if needed (should not require much since you are actually recirculating the fluid). It usually will take a pump or 2 to get a pedal again but this method works very well especially with stubborn systems.

If you still can't get a good pedal then I would suspect you either have a leak or an internally damaged hose, pay attention to your fluid level to see if it goes down.

I hope this helps you resolve your issues, please keep us up to date on your progress and thank you for using 2CarPros!
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Sunday, September 20th, 2020 AT 2:20 PM (Merged)
Tiny
KEN L
  • MASTER CERTIFIED MECHANIC
  • 47,282 POSTS
Also I have seen where the flywheel thickness will affect the clutch operation. did the mechanic check to make sure the replacement was identical? This guide can help us as well:

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/clutch-doesnt-work-sometimes-or-not-at-all

Please run down this guide and report back.

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Sunday, September 20th, 2020 AT 2:20 PM (Merged)
Tiny
TY KEITH
  • MEMBER
  • 24 POSTS
So I tried your bleed trick with no luck and flywheel was lighter. So it was totally different from OEM but supposedly was compatible.
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Sunday, September 20th, 2020 AT 2:20 PM (Merged)
Tiny
TY KEITH
  • MEMBER
  • 24 POSTS
  • 2004 MAZDA RX8
  • 2WD
  • MANUAL
  • 150,000 MILES
Is there any way to determine exactly why my clutch pedal is getting no pressure. Backstory : bought the rx8 with eletrical problems for key ignition I straight wired a wire from fuse box to key ignition car now doesn’t blow a fuse every time I turn key over and will run fine (also had to straight wire the clutch sensor to get car to turn on ) anyways drove on it for about a week noticed that car was getting up to speed when I drove it. And if I put it in first and let off clutch it would not stall and I had to give a lot of gas for it to move. So I called a shop they said it was the clutch slipping and probably needed a new flywheel since I been driving on it like that also told me to order a slave at this point I DID have pedal pressure I took him an aftermarket flywheel clutch and pressure plate along with slave and master cyl. Took him a week he called me and said he had it all in but pedal was light but it would drive. He said maybe it just needed to be broken in. So I drove it for about three days with the clutch pedal being light then all the sudden pedal sinks to floor and can’t get no pressure even with pumping it. Well I bled it a bit and the pedal comes back on it’s own but still very light and will not go into gear unless I put it in gear while rolling down a hill or something. As long as I get up to speed it will shift gears but clutch does nothing say if I rolled it down a hill to get it in first and go on the highway I can switch gears decently but if I push down on clutch and try to rev it up instead of clutch acting as a neutral it will give the car more speed. I’m stumped and don’t know where to look. But if I m sitting still and crank car up I can not put it in gear even if I try to force it it just grinds really bad
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Sunday, September 20th, 2020 AT 2:20 PM (Merged)
Tiny
TY KEITH
  • MEMBER
  • 24 POSTS
Is there any way I can check and see if it is the flywheel myself?
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Sunday, September 20th, 2020 AT 2:20 PM (Merged)
Tiny
TY KEITH
  • MEMBER
  • 24 POSTS
This is me trying to pump the slave by hand. Is it suppose to come out that slow?
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Sunday, September 20th, 2020 AT 3:11 PM
Tiny
JACOBANDNICKOLAS
  • MECHANIC
  • 109,645 POSTS
Ty,

No, it should come out quickly and smoothly each time the pedal is depressed. Either you have a bad master cylinder, slave, or there is air in the system

If I recall, these parts were all replaced, correct?

Joe
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Sunday, September 20th, 2020 AT 5:33 PM
Tiny
TY KEITH
  • MEMBER
  • 24 POSTS
Yes sir they were replaced twice. Would this mean that the slave is the problem?
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Sunday, September 20th, 2020 AT 5:54 PM
Tiny
JACOBANDNICKOLAS
  • MECHANIC
  • 109,645 POSTS
Based on how it reacts, either air is in the system or there is an issue with the slave or the clutch master cylinder. Have you bled it? If so, do you get a steady strong stream of fluid?

Joe
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Monday, September 21st, 2020 AT 5:58 PM
Tiny
TY KEITH
  • MEMBER
  • 24 POSTS
I have bled and bled and even bled some more out the master. I get a squirt type deal out the slave it’s more of a stream but it doesn’t come out as fast as the master stream does.
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Tuesday, September 22nd, 2020 AT 8:53 AM
Tiny
TY KEITH
  • MEMBER
  • 24 POSTS
V
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Tuesday, September 22nd, 2020 AT 6:08 PM
Tiny
TY KEITH
  • MEMBER
  • 24 POSTS
If that fork is vibrating like that would that mean something is wrong with it?
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Tuesday, September 22nd, 2020 AT 6:22 PM
Tiny
JACOBANDNICKOLAS
  • MECHANIC
  • 109,645 POSTS
I wonder if the external balance weight would have prevented that from happening. Keith, the slave looks like it's working properly and not slowly like the other video.
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Tuesday, September 22nd, 2020 AT 6:53 PM
Tiny
TY KEITH
  • MEMBER
  • 24 POSTS
I just replaced the slave and have the same problem lol. I can drop the transmission and post pics of that might help? At this point it’s looking like I’m going to have to anyways.
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Tuesday, September 22nd, 2020 AT 7:09 PM
Tiny
JACOBANDNICKOLAS
  • MECHANIC
  • 109,645 POSTS
I suspect that is what needs done. I have a feeling something has broken internally.

I don't know if you need them, but here are the directions for removal and replacement. The attached pics correlate with the directions.

____________________________________________

2004 Mazda RX8 2RTR-1.3L
Clutch Unit Removal & Installation
Vehicle Transmission and Drivetrain Clutch Service and Repair Procedures Clutch Unit Removal & Installation
CLUTCH UNIT REMOVAL & INSTALLATION
CLUTCH UNIT REMOVAL/INSTALLATION

pic 1

1. Remove in the order indicated in the table.
2. Install in the reverse order of removal.

Clutch Cover, Clutch Disc Removal Note

pic 2

1. Install the SSTs.
2. In cries-cross pattern, loosen the bolts one rotation at a time until there is no remaining spring pressure.
3. Remove the clutch cover and the clutch disc.

Oil Seal, Pilot Bearing Removal Note

Note:
Remove the pilot bearing only if there is a malfunction.

Pic 3

1. Remove the pilot bearing and the oil seal together using the SST.

Flywheel Removal Note

pic 4

1. Install the SST to the flywheel.
2. Remove the locknut using the SST.

Note:
Inspect the eccentric shaft for oil leakage after removing the flywheel. If necessary, replace the oil seal.

Pic 5

3. Remove the flywheel using the SST.
4. Remove the key from the eccentric shaft.

Flywheel Installation Note

pic 6

1. Install the key to the eccentric shaft.
2. Align the flywheel key groove with the eccentric shaft key and install.
3. Install the SST to the flywheel.

Pic 7

4. Apply silicone sealant to the locknut thread.

Pic 8

5. Tighten the locknut using the SST.
Tightening torque 392 - 490 Nm (40.0 - 49.9 kgf-cm, 289 - 361 ft. Lbs.)

Caution:
Remove the seal protruding from the threads without it becoming caught in the pilot bearing.

Pilot Bearing, Oil Seal Installation Note

pic 9

1. Install the pilot bearing using the SSTs.

Note:
Bearing outer diameter: 20 mm (0.787 inch)
Press-in depth: 11.5 - 12.25 mm (0.453 - 0.482 inch)

2. Install a new oil seal using the SSTs.

Clutch Disc Installation Note

pic 10

1. Clean the splines of the clutch disc and the main drive gear with a brush.
2. Spread a thin layer of clutch grease on the splines.
3. Secure the clutch disc to the flywheel using the SSTs.

Clutch Cover Installation Note

pic 11

1. Alien the clutch cover with the flywheel knock pin and install.
2. Tighten the bolts evenly and gradually.
Tightening torque 17.6 - 26.5 Nm (1.80 - 2.70 kgf-cm, 13.0 - 19.5 ft. Lbs.)

__________________

Let me know if this helps.

Joe
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Wednesday, September 23rd, 2020 AT 6:14 PM
Tiny
TY KEITH
  • MEMBER
  • 24 POSTS
I’ve taken it apart this is the only thing that seemed off it’s grinder where the throw out bearing hits and it looks like a chunk of my clutch is gone. Would either of these cause pressure loss?
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Sunday, October 18th, 2020 AT 5:05 PM
Tiny
TY KEITH
  • MEMBER
  • 24 POSTS
And sorry it took so long, I was fighting with a stripped bolt on transmission.
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Sunday, October 18th, 2020 AT 5:08 PM

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