No fuel, no spark

Tiny
JOHN KUBB
  • MEMBER
  • 1993 FORD CROWN VICTORIA
  • V8
  • 2WD
  • AUTOMATIC
  • 111,000 MILES
A year ago I replace the crankshaft position sensor camshaft position sensor. Yesterday car drove fine I want to start it last night engine cranks no fuel or spark. I swapped out the PCM relay and fuel pump relay still no fuel or spark.
Wednesday, October 7th, 2020 AT 10:43 AM

9 Replies

Tiny
KASEKENNY
  • MECHANIC
  • 18,907 POSTS
I suspect the replacement crank position sensor has failed again. This is not uncommon with replacement parts. If you have no fuel or spark then the crank sensor would be the first suspect because the PCM uses this for fuel and spark.

Take a look at this attachment that explains this.

Here is a guide that helps with this:

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/symptoms-of-a-bad-crankshaft-sensor
Was this
answer
helpful?
Yes
No
+1
Wednesday, October 7th, 2020 AT 5:07 PM
Tiny
JOHN KUBB
  • MEMBER
  • 4 POSTS
Thanks, I thought so too. I ordered one off Amazon about a hour ago. I'll let you know.
Was this
answer
helpful?
Yes
No
Friday, October 9th, 2020 AT 12:23 PM
Tiny
KEN L
  • MASTER CERTIFIED MECHANIC
  • 47,702 POSTS
KASEKENNY1 is one of our best! Please let us know what you find. We are interested to see what it is.
Was this
answer
helpful?
Yes
No
Friday, October 9th, 2020 AT 12:23 PM
Tiny
JOHN KUBB
  • MEMBER
  • 4 POSTS
Well, it wasn't the crank position sensor. I replaced it a hour ago. No fuel and no spark still. No start.
Was this
answer
helpful?
Yes
No
Friday, October 9th, 2020 AT 2:00 PM
Tiny
KASEKENNY
  • MECHANIC
  • 18,907 POSTS
Well, that is disappointing and it gives me pause. Can I ask how you are checking for fuel and spark? In other words, how do you know it does not have either?

We need to either use a noid light for the injectors, and pull a plug and hold it against the block. Or some other method like spraying starter fluid in the intake to see if it fires for a brief second.

Also, I would suggest pulling the plugs and make sure they are not fouled.

Once we confirm no fuel and spark we will need to look at the PCM. Basically if the PCM is getting the crank signal, the PCM outputs the signal to control the injectors and spark. So have we checked for codes? We may simply have an issue with the PCM Power relay or fuse. The Power relay feeds the injectors and ignition control module so that may be the issue.

I attached the info on this relay.
Was this
answer
helpful?
Yes
No
Saturday, October 10th, 2020 AT 10:48 AM
Tiny
JOHN KUBB
  • MEMBER
  • 4 POSTS
Lol, I'm 63 worked on cars all my life. Had my own mobile auto repair business. Was ASE certified, one field away from master mechanic at 53. Though it's taking it's toll on my body. Now I have a great county job. Drove it in the morning, no problem, in afternoon just cranked, had my kid crank it, no fuel pump noise for 2 seconds, even depressed the Schrader valve on the fuel line no fuel at all. Took off a wire from the coil had him crank it nothing no spark. Swapped out the PCM relay with the AC relay they are both the same still cranks but no fuel and spark. I have 3 other cars so I'm not worried but I do want to get it running, lol. I don't want to drive my 1973 Javelin to work all the time with the crazy drivers in Florida, lol.
Was this
answer
helpful?
Yes
No
Saturday, October 10th, 2020 AT 12:59 PM
Tiny
KASEKENNY
  • MECHANIC
  • 18,907 POSTS
Awesome. That means we can just move onto testing for voltage on the inputs to the PCM to make sure the PCM is getting what it needs to turn on the spark and fuel. Then we will check the output voltage from the PCM to see if it is sending the proper commands. More then likely we will have the inputs but no output from the PCM which means the PCM has failed.

Take a look at the first wiring diagram. Make sure we have 12 volts on both of these wires at the PCM.

Then the PCM is a low side driver for the injectors meaning it grounds the injectors to fire them so you should have power to them. Also, the PCM controls the fuel pump through the fuel pump relay so we need to find out if the PCM is grounding pin 85 of the fuel pump relay. You test both of these (start with the pump due to no pressure) by putting your red meter lead on battery positive and the black lead on terminal 85 of the relay. Then turn the ignition to the run position. Your meter should read 12 volts. If it does then the PCM is grounding the relay which should close the relay and turn on the pump.

As for the ignition system, let's deal with that after we fix the fuel system if it is a different issue. I highly doubt that so if we fix the fuel system, we will fix the ignition. So let's just test to see if the PCM is grounding the fuel pump relay and go from there. I suspect it is not and if we have power going to the PCM on these other two circuits then I suspect we need a PCM.

Let me know what questions you have. Thanks
Was this
answer
helpful?
Yes
No
+1
Saturday, October 10th, 2020 AT 2:20 PM
Tiny
JOHN KUBB
  • MEMBER
  • 4 POSTS
Thanks for the quick reply. I'll look at it in the next few days and keep you posted. Thanks again
Was this
answer
helpful?
Yes
No
Saturday, October 10th, 2020 AT 4:29 PM
Tiny
KASEKENNY
  • MECHANIC
  • 18,907 POSTS
Great. We will wait to hear back. Thanks for the update.
Was this
answer
helpful?
Yes
No
Saturday, October 10th, 2020 AT 5:43 PM

Please login or register to post a reply.

Sponsored links