Faint grinding noise when the steering wheel is rotated in very slow speed

Hi and thanks for using 2CarPros.

A humming noise will not come from a belt. Have you checked the power steering fluid? Steering fluid expands when it warms up. If it is low, the sound may change when the engine gets warm. Take a look through this link.

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/power-steering-problems

Next, can you tell me if the vehicle has to be moving to hear the noise or is it only when sitting still? Last, can you tell approximately where the sound is coming from?


Let me know.

Take care,

Joe

It is the original power steering fluid from 2000. The fluid level is okay.
The vehicle does not have to moving to hear the noise. The noise is there even when the car is fully stopped. When the car is stopped or moving at very slow speed, if I rotate the steering wheel either way and hold it, the grinding noise continues until I rotate the steering wheel back to straight position.
The sound seems to be coming from the front side. The sound is similar to brake dragging but I do not think the brake is dragging because the car runs fine.

Welcome back:

Okay, that eliminates a wheel/hub bearing. When you are turning the wheel that far, that puts a greater load on the power steering unit. If the fluid is dirty and has never been serviced, there is a chance it is the pump. You would need to open the hood, locate the pump, and then have a helper turn the wheel as you described so you could confirm that is where the noise is coming from.

Under these conditions, I actually use an automotive stethoscope. By placing one on the component in question, you can tell if that is where the noise is coming from.

Here are some links for you to review that discuss power steering issues, how to service the pump (which would be a good thing to try first) and in general, how one is replaced:

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/power-steering-problems

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/power-steering-fluid-flush

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/how-to-replace-a-power-steering-pump

If you decide to replace it, some pumps require that you remove the old pulley and install it on the new pump. Here is a link that shows how that is done.

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/remove-reinstall-power-steering-pulley

If you decide to rebuild the one in the vehicle, here are the directions specific to your vehicle for an overhaul. I also wanted to include this because it shows how to remove and replace the pump if you decide to just get another pump. All attached pictures correlate with these directions.
_________________________________

UNIT OVERHAUL
REMOVAL

1. Remove the pressure hose from the oil pump.
2. Disconnect the suction hose from the suction connector and drain the fluid into a container.

3. Loosen the oil pump mounting bolts to remove the V-belt.
4. Loosen the tension adjusting bolt.

5. Remove the power steering drive belt from the power steering oil pump pulley.
6. Remove the power steering oil pump mounting bolts and the tension adjusting bolt.


7. Remove the power steering oil pump assembly.

NOTE: Be careful not to drip fluid from the power steering oil pump.


8. Remove the power steering oil pump mounting bracket.


9. Remove the suction pipe and the O-ring from the oil pump.


10. Remove the rear cover with the gasket and pins.
11. Remove the cam ring.
12. Remove the rotor and vanes.
13. Remove the front side plate.


14. Remove the inner and outer O-ring.
15. Remove the spring.

NOTE: When assembling, use a new gasket and O-ring.

16. Remove the pulley nut with the spring washer.
17. Pull off the pulley and the woodruff key.


18. Remove the snap ring using snap ring pliers.
19. Drive out the pulley shaft with the bearing. If necessary, use a plastic hammer.


20. Remove the oil seal from the oil pump body.

NOTE: When assembling, use a new oil seal.

21. Remove the guide bracket and nut.


22. Remove the connector from the oil pump body, and take out the flow control valve and the flow control spring.
23. Remove the O-ring from the connector.

CAUTION: Do not disassemble the flow control valve.

24. Remove the oil pump switch.

25. Take out the spring and the spool.
26. Remove the O-ring from the oil pump switch.

REASSEMBLY
1. Install the oil pump switch.
2. Install the flow control valve spring, valve and connector in the pump body.

NOTE: Apply a thin coat of specified ATF DEXRON II type fluid to all the replaced parts including the oil seal and the O-ring.

3. Install the guide bracket and nut.

4. Using a special tool, install the oil seal into the pump body.


5. Gently insert the shaft assembly and install the snap ring.
6. Install the pump pulley with woodruff key in place.


7. Install the spring and the inner and outer O-rings.
8. Install the front side plate.


9. Insert the pins into the pin grooves of front housing, then install the cam ring, paying attention to its direction.

10. Install the rotor with its punch marked side facing towards the front side plate.
11. Install the vane plates with the round end facing outward.
12. Install the gasket and the rear cover.
13. Tighten the suction connector.
14. Installation is the reverse order of removal.

NOTE:
1. Install the hoses so that they are not twisted and they do not come in contact with any other parts.
2. Install parts by referring to the torque specification.
3. Replenish the fluid.
Recommended fluid Specified PSF - 3 type
4. Bleed the system.
5. Check the oil pump pressure.

INSPECTION
1. Clean all disassembled parts with a suitable cleaning solvent.
2. If any inside parts of the oil pump have been damaged, replace the pump as an assembly.
3. If the pulley is cracked or deformed, replace it.
4. If oil leaks around the pulley shaft oil seal, replace the oil seal.
5. If the serrations of the pulley or pulley shaft are deformed or worn, replace them.

___________________________________

I have to be honest. By the time you purchase parts and the time you will put into it, I feel you would be further ahead just to get a remanufactured pump from a parts store. However, I wanted to include it in case you decided to rebuild the one you have.

Take care and let me know how things go or if you have any questions. Happy Thanksgiving to you and your family, too.

Joe

Thank you for the detailed reply. I did some testing and found the following:
The noise only happens when the car is in gear, moving slowly or fully stopped with steering rotated and held in rotated position.
No noise when rotating the steering and the engine is off.
No noise when rotating the steering and the engine is on but the transmission is in parked position.
By the way can I first try to take out some PS fluid with a turkey baster and replace with fresh fluid? Is there a drain plug to easily get rid of the old fluid?

Welcome back.

Is there any way you could upload an audio of the noise you are hearing so I can hear it? Also, servicing the system is always a good first step. Using a turkey baster is a good idea. But, just because it is Thanksgiving, does not mean it can be reused when you finish. LOL

Draw out as much as you can and then refill. Start the engine and turn the steering all the way left and all the way right. Do this several times.

Repeat that process until the fluid remains clean. There are no drains for this.

Let me know if that helps.

Joe

The power steering fluid reservoir probably holds 1 or 2 ounces of fluid total. Is it okay to siphon out the 2 ounces of fluid or do I have to maintain a minimum fluid level at all times like the brake fluid reservoir?

When you remove fluid, replace what was taken with new before starting.

As far as maintaining a minimum such as a master cylinder, it is not necessary. However, do not start the engine when it is low.

Let me know how things go for you.

Joe

I saw on YouTube videos that people are suggested unplugging the low pressure hose and draining all fluid and turning engine on and rotating steering to get all fluid out. Is that not risky that way because the pump may burn out running without fluid? By the way, is it okay to use generic power steering fluid sold at Walmart?

Hi again:

As long as the fluid meets the manufacturer's specs, it will be fine. As far as disconnecting the low pressure hose? Ugh, you will end up with a big mess if you start the engine. Also, you do not want to run the pump empty or low on fluid.

I do not have the owner's manual. Anyone has the PDF? I called both AutoZone and Advanced Auto and they both said their store brand generic power steering fluid should be fine. Do you know what kind of power steering fluid used by 2000 Hyundai Elantra? I checked the reservoir and the cap and they did not say what type of fluid to use. I am planning to use Walmart Supertech power steering fluid.

Welcome back.

I attached a picture which indicates the type of power steering used in this vehicle.
Dexron II which is actually automatic transmission fluid. Regardless, that is what it requires.

Thanks for the information. I went to Walmart today but could not find Dexron II. There are plenty of Dexron III, IV and their generics available. Is Dexron III or IV or high mileage ATF okay for this vehicle's power steering?

Welcome back:
Based on my research, Dexron III is fine to use.

Let me know if you have other questions. Also, often times, it will indicate on the bottle what it is compatible with.

Take care,
Joe

Is it okay to use Type F ATF in 2000 Hyundai Elantra power steering?

Welcome back:

Although they are similar, I wouldn't use it. Use the dexron III they had.

Let me know if you have other questions.

Joe

There was an incident. The car lost power steering ability while driving and then several minutes later some of the power in steering came back. After opening the hood I saw power steering fluid around the power steering reservoir and even on the hood, so the old fluid leaked for some reason. I was supposed to siphon out the old fluid anyway in order to get rid of the whining noise. This incident kind of helped me getting rid of the old fluid.
Previously, there was a grinding/whining sound coming from the drive belt area that's why I started this thread, now the noise is even louder since the incident.
Bought a Sea Foam Hydra Trans Tune and a quart of Dexron II and III compatible ATF. Added 6 ounces of Sea Foam and filled the rest of the power steering reservoir with the ATF.
Started the car, rotated the steering end-to-end, idled for a while and then drove around. When the steering rotated to either ends, the whining got louder. Didn't see any fluid leaking.
I took the power steering belt off and checked the power steering pulley and it was wiggling up to a few millimeters which didn't feel normal. I have audio and video, will it help if I upload? Is it a bad power steering pump or just the pulley?

If you are getting up and down play in the pulley, that isn't normal. Also, you may be getting a leak from the seal at the front of the pump where the shaft comes through to attach to the pulley.

Upload the sound and if you can, a video of you moving the pulley so I can see how much play is there. If it leaked once, it's going to again. Also, since is sprayed, either the high pressure line leaked (which would still be leaking) or fluid came through the aforementioned shaft, hitting the pulley and flinging everywhere.

Let me know.

Joe

I was driving today and I lost power steering. Parked and went shopping and afterwards the steering was still very hard and then it eased up and I got power steering back. Drove around for a couple of hours and power steering was fine. Haven't opened the hood yet to see if the fluid leaked. Will update soon. I just wanted to upload the video from yesterday. It is no longer a faint sound as I initially reported.
I could not upload the audio file which I recorded yesterday. The web site said file type not allowed. Only video files and photos can be uploaded.

Hi:
Does the noise change when turning?

Joe

The noise is constant. The loudness lowers a bit after driving for half an hour or more, but not by much.
When parked and the steering is rotated from lock to lock, there is an additional whining noise when the steering reaches the max left or right.
When the engine is started cold there is the other grinding noise when the steering is rotated from straight and held at a rotated position, either left or right which is the initial reason I started this thread. Is there any way I can send you guys the audio files?
By the way, the power steering fluid did not leak yesterday when I lost power on the steering.

Welcome back:

You can add audio via the video selection. As far as the problem, I am starting to think the problem may not be the pump, but rather the rack and pinion going bad. Does it ever feel tight like it doesn't want to turn or as if it sticks?

Let me know.
Joe

Thanks for the reply. So far, the power on steering was lost twice while driving and the steering became hard and then it automatically restored itself after ten minutes. The constant rattling sound is likely coming from the power steering pump (not 100% sure though) because the power steering pulley has a lot of play.

If I take the power steering belt off and start the engine, will it harm the car? That way if the rattling sound goes away because of the non-rotating power steering pulley, it will eliminate the power steering pump and pulley as the suspects, right?

I checked YouTube videos and the classic rack and pinion symptoms are not there. After making a turn, the steering auto-centers itself and rotates back to straight position automatically just like a new car.

Hi:

It is safe to remove the belt, but don't run the engine longer than you need because other problems can happen. Just run it a few seconds to determine of the noise is gone.

Since you have the play, chances are the pump is bad.

Let me know.
Joe

I haven't had a chance to remove the power steering belt and determine the source of the noise yet. It is too cold outside.
There is a brand new sound coming from underneath the car. It sounds like rubber rubbing. The noise is loud and only happens after starting the engine and eventually becomes a softer intermittent noise after a few minutes. I'll upload the sound samples soon.

Welcome back:

That sounds like the serpentine belt. When the weather changes, remove the belt and see if anything is locking up. I have a feeling that is what you are going to find.

Let me know

Joe

Here is an audio file. There are two noises. One is the constant rattle from beginning to end which I suspect to be the power steering pulley. But the new sound is the squeak, sound like rubber balloon rubbing against something.

Hi again. They must not have uploaded. Nothing is there.

The site will not accept mp3 or m4a audio files. I converted the mp3 file to a mp4 and it will still not upload.

Used an online tool and created a video from the audio file and a photo that this website will allow uploading. Here is the audio:

I got it. I hear a bearing noise which is most likely the pump. My belief is the pump is causing the belt issue. Other than the bad bearing noise that I'm hearing, I can't hear anything from the belt itself, but suspect it the pump is causing the problem.

That squeaking noise that sounds like rubber or plastic rubbing that starts from the tenth second of the video is the new noise I am talking about. It does not seem like bearing noise to me. Can you please listen to it again and let me know?

Below is another audio. I am concerned about the squeaking and banging noise that starts after seven seconds on the video and lasts until the end of the video. This is a new noise that recently started besides the constant rattle of the power steering pulley. The noise starts when the engine is restarted and the car starts moving. The noise kind of goes away (but not all the way) after a few minutes. The car drives okay even with this new rubber ducky squeaking noise. What is causing this new squeak and thud noise?

Welcome back:
I hear it for sure. Without being there, I can't say with 100% certainty. However, it does sound like one of the belt driven accessories. You should remove the belt and check all of the belt driven accessories. If the pump is bad, it should be replaced. It may be making all the noises you hear. Honestly, it wouldn't surprise me. You may be hearing the belt moving on the pulley causing a squeak. As the pump gets worse, sound will most likely change again.

Joe

Thanks for your reply.
This car has 3 drive belts. Is it OK to run the engine with all 3 belts removed? Can I actually drive the car without the belts?

Welcome back:
Yes, you can for a very short time without the belts. However, no longer than a few seconds to see if the sound is gone. The belts run the alternator, water pump... so if must be a brief amount of time.

Thanks for your reply. The new squeaky sound appears only when the car is moving.
How can I test that without driving the car which requires all belts to be on?
The new squeak that is on the latest video is coming from underneath the car which is movement related. I'd be surprised if the bad PS pulley is also causing the new squeak. Maybe bad rack and pinion? Maybe bad bearing or ball joint (all of which have been replaced in the last year)?
I have not taken the belt off yet because it is extremely cold outside.

Hi:

I didn't realize it was coming from under the vehicle, so I agree with you. If it is speed related, check to make sure the brakes are good. They do have a warning sensor on the pads that will squeak when the pads need replaced. Also, take notice if the sound or pitch changes when turning and let me know what you find.

Joe

I reached out to you earlier regarding this but never had a chance to fix the issue. My old Hyundai is making loud grinding noise when moving. For the last couple of years there a rumbling noise when moving and the wheel bearing and ball-joint were replaced last year. But the rumbling noise never went away. It is a rumbling, crumbling and very loud grinding noise now. Tested wheel today, no sideways or up and down play at 3 and 9 O'clock and 6 and 12 O'clock. Dust shield is not scraping. The ball-joints and rubber boots look okay. Brake pads are one year old. The slight rattling and ticking noise when the car starts is a power steering pump noise which is very different than the rumbling grinding noise that I am trying to diagnose. Over the winter months there a squeaky rubber-ducky type noise which is gone now. The car has been making this grinding noise for six months now and it runs fine otherwise. Is it the strut bearing or the joints, worn out rubber or something else making the grinding noise? Advanced thanks for your help. I uploaded a video on YouTube regarding this issue. Here is the link:
https://youtu.be/nrz6r30mspg
I also have two audio files.

Here is another low resolution dash-cam video with audio. You can hear the rubber-ducky type sound when going round at the cul-de-sac towards the end. Previously I mentioned the rubber-ducky type sound was gone.
I boosted the audio gain by 20dB on the youtube video which may appear a bit noisy, my bad. I tried uploading the 2 "clean" MP3 audio files to 2carpros but your website stated "file type not allowed". Is there any way to send you those audio files? Advanced thanks for your help.

Hello,

Just a quick question. Did someone driving this vehicle run over a curb or go to fast over a high speed bump or something like that? Okay, now on to the problem. This sounds to me like you have a Constant Velocity Joint(s)(CV Joint)(s) that are going out on this vehicle. From what I can on the video the rubber ducky noise sounds like a popping noise when you are going around corners. This is what a CV joint that is going out will sound like. Anyway, in the diagrams down below I have included a trans axle diagnostic chart for what the problem is when this noise is present, and an exploded view of the trans axle assembly, as well as removal and installation instructions for the CV joint. Please go through the guides and get back to us with what you are able to find out.

Thanks,
Alex
2CarPros