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Engine no start problem?

Tiny
BLAZER98
  • MEMBER
  • 1995 CHEVROLET MONTE CARLO
  • 6 CYL
  • 2WD
  • AUTOMATIC
  • 147,000 MILES
The security light came on 4 days ago then went out. Car has a remote starter-it was installed by previous owner but works fine. Had some prior starting problems with key. (Key has pellet in it. Tried different key same thing. Had to wait 5 minutes then car would start. 3 days ago, car stalled on me after starting-like it was out of gas), Did this 3 times. Gas gauge jumps so I figuresd maybe I was out of fuel. Put fuel in. Car ran fine. Parked for the night. Next morning, no start, no crank, no fuel pump noise. All dash lights are on. Checked battery-has 12.05vdc. Checked all fuses in panel and under hood- all ok. Figured starter burnt out. Replaced it-still the same situation. Removed remoted starter (just unplugs) from system-same thing. I am at a loss and very low on funds-I can only make a small donation, but if you get me running (I'm old school mechanics, it's the computer stuff that I have difficulty with), I will make a donation of whatever I am able to. Please respond asap. I need to work tomorrow. Thank you.
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Thursday, January 1st, 2009 AT 8:59 AM

38 Replies

Tiny
IMPALASS
  • MECHANIC
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Hello -

To better assist you is your model a LS or Z34? Also please provide your engine size in liter and the 8th digit of your VIN.

When you say no start and no crank........... You turned the key and nothing happened it was all totally quiet... No engine turning at all..... So you changed the starter?

Before I get your answer I am going to assume that all is dead other than you turn the key on, the dash lights up normal but all is dead and quiet.

If you take jumper cables and put the positive directly on the starter does it work then with key on?

Plug the remote back together also..... And try it that way.....
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Thursday, January 1st, 2009 AT 9:39 AM
Tiny
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Hello -

Hey also, do you know how to check the codes on your car? If so check them... If not let me know and I will tell you how.
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Thursday, January 1st, 2009 AT 9:47 AM
Tiny
BLAZER98
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Thank you for getting back so quick. To answer about codes, I have no plug in computer, but I believe you can jump receptacle under dash with paper clip to get reading. But not sure which pins to jump. If you can tell me how, I can do it. Also to answer other question on first post-- car is a LS, engine is 3.1Liter, VIN 2G1WW12M9S9142038
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Thursday, January 1st, 2009 AT 9:57 AM
Tiny
BLAZER98
  • MEMBER
  • 20 POSTS
Jumped starter from running vehicle. Negative cable to battery negative, positive to starter with key in run position. NOTHING! Hooked security module back up and still nothing, repeated, nothing. Anything else?
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Thursday, January 1st, 2009 AT 10:04 AM
Tiny
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  • MECHANIC
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Hello -

Okay. . .. . ...thanks for the info. . .. . .. . ...

For checking codes. . .. . ..you are correct. . .. . .. . .you jump A and B pin together with a paperclip or something like that. I realize the car won't start but I still stress that in my directions to not turn it all the way to run.

I have attached how you check for codes. See if it makes sense to you. The big thing. . ...DO NOT START THE CAR!

You basically put as a jumper wire or paper clip and jump from the A pin to the B pin. Jump them together.

You then turn the car on to where JUST the lights on the dash come on ONLY. . ...DO NOT START THE CAR!

Watch your check engine light.

The first flash is the first number and the second flash it the second number. So you sit with paper and pencil and count the flashes. It will flash the same number 3 times and then go to the next if there is one. It should always start with 12. So for 12 it will be:

Flash (1) pause flash, flash (2), longer pause. . .. Flash (1) pause flash, flash (2), longer pause. . .. Flash (1) pause flash, flash (2), longer pause. . ..

Now from this point on watch and count the other numbers. Say it is 31. It would be:

Flash, Flash, Flash (3) pause flash (1) longer pause. . .. Flash, Flash, Flash (3) pause flash (1) longer pause. . .. Flash, Flash, Flash (3) pause flash (1) longer pause. . ..that would be code 31.

The second you see it repeating it self, then turn the car off and immediately remove the paper clip or jumper wire so you don't forget.

Again - I can not stress enough. . .. . .DO NOT START THE CAR.

Now for the jumping the starter. . .. . .. . ..If I understand you correctly you jumped from another running vehicle. . .. . .. . .. . ..since the battery of your MC is good. . ...(from what we know since the dash lights come on) just run the positive jumper cable from the pos post and tough the nut that the positive cable attaches to on the starter and see what you get.

If you jump from another car then you may have to go. . ...running car: neg to neg battery post and pos to pos battery post. . .. . ..MC. . .. . ..neg to some metal object on the engine. . ..positive directly to starter.

Okay. . .. . .. . .let me know. . .. . .. . .. . ..Happy New Year by the way. . .. . .make sure you eat some black-eyed peas!


https://www.2carpros.com/forum/automotive_pictures/248015_DLC_1.jpg

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Thursday, January 1st, 2009 AT 10:36 AM
Tiny
BLAZER98
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Thank you for your quick response. I'm checking the codes now and will get back asap. You are an angel to be doing this so quickly for me on a holiday!
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Thursday, January 1st, 2009 AT 11:03 AM
Tiny
BLAZER98
  • MEMBER
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Ok- I went to check the codes as you said. I inserted the paper clip, but the "B" spot had no wire! Only wire in the bracket was the "A". I turned the key to RUN position and heard the fuel pump whir. I tried to start-NO PAPER CLIP IN ANYTHING!-It started and dies. Did this 3 times. Then started and ran with a lot of hesitation. Started again and ran for 1 minute then died like it was running out of fuel? Couldn't get a code reading at all. (NO PINS IN BRACKET-don't know where they went to but will go out and look under dash.). Started again and it ran for a minute then sounded like it was bogging down and stalled. Possibly the fuel pump? (It was still making some noise) If so, do I have to drop the fuel tank to get to it? I have 3/4 tank of fuel. Thanks, Henny
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Thursday, January 1st, 2009 AT 11:19 AM
Tiny
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Hello -

Not a problem - glad to help.........
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Thursday, January 1st, 2009 AT 11:19 AM
Tiny
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Henny

Do you have any starting fluid to spray into the throttle body to see if it wants to stay running?

I will be checking on the other thing you ask... Yes check under the dash to see where that went?
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Thursday, January 1st, 2009 AT 11:23 AM
Tiny
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Henny

Yes sorry, it does appear you have to drop the tank....... Have you done this before
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Thursday, January 1st, 2009 AT 11:28 AM
Tiny
BLAZER98
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Car runs for about 1 minute, will do the startibng fluid thing now and check under dash. Will be back shortly. Thanks.
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Thursday, January 1st, 2009 AT 11:31 AM
Tiny
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Henny

I am trying to locate the color of the wires for the DLC to better assist.

Again, have you ever dropped a tank before?
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Thursday, January 1st, 2009 AT 11:34 AM
Tiny
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Henny

How many wires do you show? 4 maybe

Black in the A pin
Grey in the D pin
Dark Green in the J pin
Tan in the M pin
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Thursday, January 1st, 2009 AT 11:40 AM
Tiny
BLAZER98
  • MEMBER
  • 20 POSTS
Yes. I've dropped the tank on my 69 olds cutlass, and my son's 94 mustang, did a fuel pump on a 2001 mitsu under the rear seat.
The wires for the bracket have been removed and wired into what looks a module for the remote starter. I can't make out exactly how they are wired. It is a jumbled mess. I can take a pic if my camera works and that helps you. I also tried the starting fluid and the engine did die even though I sprayed as it ran. There is also some sort of toggle switch under the dash that seem to be wired into the remote starter. It doesn't seem to make a difference either way. It will start and run for a minute either way.
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Thursday, January 1st, 2009 AT 11:47 AM
Tiny
BLAZER98
  • MEMBER
  • 20 POSTS
I included the pics from under the dash. It is a mess. There is a small gray box for the remote starter and a long black box also. Don't know what they do or how to bypass them if they are the problem.


https://www.2carpros.com/forum/automotive_pictures/294778_monte_001_2.jpg



https://www.2carpros.com/forum/automotive_pictures/294778_monte_002_2.jpg

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Thursday, January 1st, 2009 AT 12:01 PM
Tiny
BLAZER98
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The only wire in that is in the bracket is 2 wire dual color black and tan
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Thursday, January 1st, 2009 AT 12:07 PM
Tiny
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Hello -

Well, look at the wire colors that I attached and see if they are the correct colors before the pic.

It may not want to run because the air cleaner is off....... Sometimes the TBs act like that.

Swap your fuel relay with another like relay.....

Here is some info on the relay.........

Description and Operation
Notes

When the ignition switch is turned to the "ON" position (before engaging starter), the Powertrain Control Module (PCM) energizes the fuel pump relay for two seconds causing the fuel pump to pressurize the fuel system. If the PCM does not receive ignition reference pulses (engine cranking or running) within two seconds, it shuts "OFF" the fuel pump relay, causing the fuel pump to stop.

As a backup system to the fuel pump relay the fuel pump also can be energized by the fuel pump switch and engine oil pressure sensor. The sensor has two internal circuits. One operates the oil pressure indicator or gage on the instrument cluster, and the other is a normally open switch which closes when oil pressure reaches about 28 kPa (4 psi). If the fuel pump relay fails, a Diagnostic Trouble Code (DTC) 54 will be set in the PCM, and the fuel pump and engine oil pressure indicator switch runs the fuel pump.

An inoperative fuel pump relay can result in long cranking times, particularly if the engine is cold. The fuel pump switch and engine oil pressure indicator switch energizes the fuel pump as soon as oil pressure reaches about 28 kPa (4 psi).

It may be the fuel pump..... Looks like you have had your share of tank drops..... Fun isn't it... Okay, maybe not.....I do not understand why they don't put access panels in them all.
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Thursday, January 1st, 2009 AT 12:08 PM
Tiny
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Hello -

Wow you are fast....... Nice pics......... Thanks

When you say 2 wire....... Black tan... Is that two wires, one black and one tan?

If it is two wires....... One black and one tan... Try taking the codes from that.......
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Thursday, January 1st, 2009 AT 12:11 PM
Tiny
BLAZER98
  • MEMBER
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There are 2 wires (one black and one tan) that are put into one electrical spade type connector and that is in the slot for wire "A"
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Thursday, January 1st, 2009 AT 12:21 PM
Tiny
IMPALASS
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Hello -

Jump those two... The black to the tan - sorry to say again..... But please don't' start the car
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Thursday, January 1st, 2009 AT 12:36 PM

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