Tag light issue

Tiny
GANDALF776
  • MEMBER
  • 1996 CHEVROLET 1500
  • 5.7L
  • V8
  • 4WD
  • AUTOMATIC
  • 260,000 MILES
I have a 1996 K-1500 Chevrolet with the aftermarket bumper that has the two round push in tag light. The ones that if you live on dirt roads the get dirt and mud on them and they loose ground or the bulb shorts out. Well a very kind police officer informed me the other night that mine were not working. Luckily he has a similar truck and knows that they tend to do that so all I got was a warning. I was on the way to some friends and once there turned out they had one they bought for someone else's truck but ended up not using it. So I wired it up took some sandpaper to the hole and stuck it in but no go. On the way home I decided to see if I could eliminate the problem, So I soldered a wire to each of the sockets on the outside. I checked from the end of the wire to the socket and got 0 ohms resistance so I know the solder took hold. I put a bulb in each one and stopped under my hood and touched it to the battery. Both lights worked. Wired them in turned on the lights. No tag lights. I pulled out both bulbs and read 12 volts between the center contact and the socket on both put the bulb back in still no lights. Anybody got any ideas here because I am baffled. I tested them before I put them in and they worked. I have the right voltage but they do not work.
Saturday, November 24th, 2018 AT 11:54 AM

11 Replies

Tiny
JACOBANDNICKOLAS
  • MECHANIC
  • 109,758 POSTS
Hi and thanks for using 2CarPros.

You did everything right, but for some reason the bulb isn't making contact. Most commonly, the power supply (center bottom) of the light socket will drop in too far and then the light does not touch it for power. If you have power and ground, that is my guess at this point.

If that is the case, replace the socket. I have never been able to repair those sockets. It is almost as if the plastic under the power supply melts and the power drops too low for the bulb to reach.

Let me know if that helps. Also, just for the heck of it, with the lights on, push in on the wire from behind the socket. If it is loose, the bulb should light.

Take care,
Joe
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Saturday, November 24th, 2018 AT 6:46 PM
Tiny
GANDALF776
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Thanks Joe for your reply. I thought of that too. Ii can feel the spring in the bottom of the socket as I push in on the bulb and tried pulling and pushing on the center wire with no change. Also I did mention one was a new unit. Also I think if this had been the case they would not have lit up at the battery before installing them. I am now wondering if there is an air space between the inner and outer walls of the socket and the battery at 14 volts was enough to bridge that gap but the voltage drop along the way to the back of the truck is not. I have never cut one of them open and have never seen a cut away view. Another thought I had is there any way the bulb could be creating a direct short back to the socket yet then it should not have passed the battery test if that was the case.
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Saturday, November 24th, 2018 AT 7:23 PM
Tiny
JACOBANDNICKOLAS
  • MECHANIC
  • 109,758 POSTS
Welcome back.
If the bulb was shorting, it would blow a fuse.

Okay, lets start over. I attached the portion of the wiring schematic for you to see. Now, according to the schematic, there are two brown wires, one to each of the two lights. Then, there are two black to ground on the frame.

If you are getting power to the brown wires and you have a good ground, I cannot see how it does not work unless the sockets are bad. I misunderstood earlier. I thought you did not use the new socket.

What I want you to try is this. Make a long jumper wire that will reach from the black ground wires from the lights and run it directly to the negative battery terminal. If they work, you have a bad ground. I realize you have cleaned a new ground, but it may fail under a load. This way we can confirm if a good power supply is going to the light. If it does light, we need to make a new ground. I cannot tell you how many times I would check continuity for ground and it checks good until a load is placed on it.

Try this and let me know what happens.

Joe
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Saturday, November 24th, 2018 AT 8:00 PM
Tiny
GANDALF776
  • MEMBER
  • 10 POSTS
Okay Joe, this is not a factory bumper. This has the single wire tag lights that have been around for years that are suppose to ground when you push them in the hole but when that failed is why I solder a wire to the socket to create a better ground. I was just discussing this with a friend and we thought about running a jumper direct from the battery checking both power and ground as they did work when I battery tested them before installing them. So that will be in the morning and Ii will post my findings. One thing I did not think to mention as it is not a constant issue but sometimes the left turn light on the dash does not come on yet the bulbs are blinking on the outside. Did not know if maybe that is related some how as it is all exterior lighting except for the turn lights in the dash.
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Saturday, November 24th, 2018 AT 8:26 PM
Tiny
GANDALF776
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This is the style I have, but on mine I have soldered a ground wire to the outside of the socket.
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Saturday, November 24th, 2018 AT 9:46 PM
Tiny
JACOBANDNICKOLAS
  • MECHANIC
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Welcome back:
Where did you ground the wire that you soldered to the light socket?

As far as signal light, I think we have body ground issues which affect different things at different times. At the battery, there will be a main ground that goes to the engine block. Check for other body grounds from the negative terminals. Make sure they are in good condition. Let me know if when you run a long jumper to the battery ground from the socket if it works. If the power supply to the light from the harness is working, it has to be a ground issue.

I am not sure where you are located, but in PA, we have all kinds of ground problems due to rust and corrosion.

Let me know,

Joe
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Saturday, November 24th, 2018 AT 10:19 PM
Tiny
GANDALF776
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Joe, I live out in the country in Oklahoma. I have three miles of dirt and gravel roads before I reach paved streets. So anytime I need to go anywhere that turns into six miles three going out and three coming home. Plenty of mud puddles and dust. This is not the first set of lights I have had to replace. Usually it is simple I hook the two center wires to the brown wire and take some sandpaper to the hole and pop them in. This time it was already late evening parts stores were closed but my friend had one new one and thought one would be better than chancing running into an officer that was not so understanding. So I did the usual cut one out and used a butt connector to splice it in and sanded the hole and popped it in but I got no light. So I headed home thinking the bumper had lost ground somehow. That was when the idea to add a ground wire came to me so I would not have to rely on such a cheesy ground. So I soldered a wire on and checked continuity to make sure I had a good ground then did a battery test which told me both lights now worked. I have a 4 pin trailer plug that is teed into the rear harness connector instead of the chop job a lot of people do. So I turned on the lights and checked the plug to make sure that it was indeed a source of ground and then tested the brown wire to make sure there was power and there was. So took the center wires to the brown and then followed my trailer plug ground which was hooked to the bumper so knowing that this was already a ground source I hooked the soldered wires up to the same spot. Then turned the lights on but no tag lights so Ii pulled the bulbs and checked center contact to socket and there was 12 volts put the bulbs back in still nothing. Pulled and pushed on the center wire to check for spring tension and slack between bulb and wire everything was tight and still nothing. I went straight from battery test to installation and after confirming there is power and ground to the socket there is no logical reason why this did not work. After breakfast in the morning I will be running the jumper set up and will post the results of that.
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Saturday, November 24th, 2018 AT 11:07 PM
Tiny
GANDALF776
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Sorry it took so long to get back to you we got hit with a winter storm this morning freezing temperatures and 40 mph wind. Here is what I did and the results Ii built and ran a dual line jumper from the battery to the back of the truck. Made sure they had power meter read 13.81 volts first I cut the ground loose from the bumper and hooked that up and turned the lights on still nothing. Then cut the brown wire and hooked it to the jumper bot tag lights lit up just as they did when I battery tested them before installing them. Then to verify it is a power issue I hooked the ground back to the bumper and both lights lit up. So that eliminates all questions about grounding problem. Before crawling out from under there I checked the brown wire it had 12.37 volts. I still do not get where the problem is one would think that would be enough voltage to run the tag lights. Now the question is, where does the power in the brown wire come from and do I replace the wire or go with the toggle switch plan?
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Sunday, November 25th, 2018 AT 9:11 AM
Tiny
JACOBANDNICKOLAS
  • MECHANIC
  • 109,758 POSTS
Interesting. So, there is 12v volts in the brown wire and it does not light up, but when you supply a jumper wire to power, they do.

The only thing I can think of is there is not a big enough draw on the brown wire when you test it for it to fail. However, the bulbs draw enough to cause it not to work.

With that in mind, here is what to do. The power to the brown wire comes from the left rear tail light. It attached via a splice in the wiring. My guess is there is a weak connection at that point. What I would do is simply go back to where the splice is located and check it. With the lights on, wiggle that splice around to see if the lights flicker.

If they do not, cut the brown wire running to the lic lights and replace it. It must have a break in it at some point.

I attached the schematic that shows where they splice together. Do this and let me know how it goes.

Joe
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Sunday, November 25th, 2018 AT 4:14 PM
Tiny
GANDALF776
  • MEMBER
  • 10 POSTS
Well for now I went with a toggle switch as long as I remember to turn it on and off which it should not be in a couple of days when I go pick up a lighted toggle switch and swap them out. Thank you your advice was most helpful. At least now I can drive after dark again.
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Sunday, November 25th, 2018 AT 7:07 PM
Tiny
JACOBANDNICKOLAS
  • MECHANIC
  • 109,758 POSTS
Happy to help. Let me know if I can help in the future.

Take care,
Joe
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Sunday, November 25th, 2018 AT 10:26 PM

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