Code P0717

Tiny
BRANDON COE
  • MEMBER
  • 2009 CHEVROLET COBALT
  • 2.2L
  • 2WD
  • AUTOMATIC
  • 147,000 MILES
Having issue where getting p0717 input turbine speed sensor issue.
I'm getting some hard shifts, shifting late. Needing help to fix. Dont know where this is located on or if in the transmission.
Wednesday, May 29th, 2019 AT 8:20 AM

13 Replies

Tiny
KASEKENNY
  • MECHANIC
  • 18,907 POSTS
Hi Brandon,

I attached the diagnostic info for this code. Also, I attached the repair procedure for the input speed sensor. It looks like this is on the valve body inside the transmission pan.

However, this code clearly is the cause of your shifting issues. The input speed sensor is used by the TCM to determine shift points and line pressure. If this is not accurate then it will cause shifting issues. However, before you just disassemble the transmission to replace this, I would run through the diagram because it could be the TCM itself.

Please let me know if you need more information but this test process is what you need to determine what repair is needed. Thanks
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Wednesday, May 29th, 2019 AT 2:37 PM
Tiny
DAVE1970
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I am having the same issue as the OP was having, with the trans (4T45E) hunting for gears etc. (2009 Cobalt Lt 2.2L)
I did all the test posted using the J44152 jumper harness and everything checked out in spec, so the Diag sheet said to replace the TCM.
I replaced the TCM with a reman unit using the VIN, with the new TCM, it now shifts fine even after multiple engine stop restarts on test drives, it would always turn on the CEL after the 2nd start up and start hunting for gears, now the CEL light still comes on setting the P0717 code but it no longer hunts for gears.
Now with the very limited use of a Pro scanner, the transmission live data still shows the same ISS drop out below around a 1,000 RPMS with both TCM's, but when I use a DVOM to check the voltage output of the ISS straight off the jumper harness (I did this before and after TCM replacement), the voltage values go up smoothly and back down smoothly with the engine RPMs, but the scanner is still showing the same ISS dropping out. Is it possible to have a bad ECM that is not picking up the ISS reference voltage from the TCM and displaying it on the scanners live data and setting the code P0717?

I know I could have gotten a defective new TCM, but it is a different TCM (I kept the old one) with the same (only one) transmission code set, but with no symptoms with the new one, meaning if the light did not come on, you would not know anything was wrong.

Hope someone can help out with this.
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Thursday, May 30th, 2024 AT 8:11 PM
Tiny
KEN L
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  • 47,632 POSTS
It sure is, the data input can become intermittent do to a failing PCM. I would search google or eBay for a pre-programmed rebuilt unit and install it, here is how in the images below. Check out the images (below). Please let us know what happens.
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Friday, May 31st, 2024 AT 9:38 AM
Tiny
DAVE1970
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Okay, I have not replaced the PCM Yet (new TCM still), transmission still feels normal, but on live data (I am using a much cheaper scanner this time) at idle in park the TCC slip speed is 678ish RPMS (vey close to engine RPMS), and it goes up and down as it should when giving it gas and letting off, but the ISS is 0 RPMS no matter the engine RPM in park, power torque the engine in drive up to about 1700ish RPMS and the TCC reads normal, but the ISS is still showing 0 RPMS.
Now put it in drive or reverse, and once the VSS shows 2 MPH (car moving) the output speed sensor starts showing the RPMS (normal) and the ISS starts showing RPMS above about 350-380 RPMS, then everything looks normal, the TCC applies and the TCC slip speed RPMS drop to about 14 RPM (normal) (and I ran out of road, testing), but when I let off the gas and apply the brakes the TCC slip speed goes crazy, up to 8100+ RPMS and back down again to normal, then while coming to a stop (every time), the ISS right about 350-380 RPMS and at about 2 MPH the ISS drops off back to 0 RPMS, TCC slip speed still normal 670ish RPMS.
And since the TCC slip speed looks normal (mostly) but the ISS doesn't show any RPMS until the car is moving above 2 MPH, does this confirm the PCM requires replacing?
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Tuesday, June 4th, 2024 AT 2:25 PM
Tiny
KEN L
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With these numbers I would try replacing the input shaft speed sensor because it sounds like it is defective. Here is its location.

1 - TFP Manual Valve Position Switch Assembly
2 - 1-2 Shift Solenoid Valve
3 - 2-3 Shift Solenoid Valve
4 - Output Speed Sensor
5 - Input Speed Sensor
6 - Pressure Control Solenoid
7 - TCC Control PWM Solenoid

Check out the images (below). Please let us know what happens.
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Wednesday, June 5th, 2024 AT 9:26 AM
Tiny
DAVE1970
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If the TCC Slip Speed RPMS are correct and the trans is shifting correctly now, how can the ISS reading not be correct?

Doesn't the TCC Slip Speed get it's info from the ISS to calculate the TCC Slip Speed RPMS?
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Wednesday, June 5th, 2024 AT 11:25 AM
Tiny
KEN L
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If the transmission is working correctly is there still a problem? Yes the ISS tells the PCM the TCC slip, you say, "off the gas and apply the brakes the TCC slip speed goes crazy, up to 8100+ RPMS and back down again to normal" this is normal as the engine is idle and the transmission internals are still moving at the speed of the car until stopped.
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Wednesday, June 5th, 2024 AT 4:43 PM
Tiny
DAVE1970
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Yes, the P0717 code will not go away, I'm guessing because the scanner shows no ISS signal, but I'm guessing the TCM can read the signal OK and that is why it still shifts normal, lock up and all.

That makes since about the crazy TCC slip numbers, thanks.

So I am taking it you still think this is a PCM issue and not a defective new TCM issue or ISS/harness issue?
The PCM is not reading the TCM correctly then, therefor setting the P0717 code?

Thank you for all your help on this BTW.
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Wednesday, June 5th, 2024 AT 8:45 PM
Tiny
KEN L
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If you have tried replacing the sensor then next, I would check the wiring because the code is for a circuit error.

Code P0717 indicates an issue with the input/turbine speed sensor circuit.

Here is a guide to help:

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/how-to-check-wiring

Check out the images (below). Let us know how it goes.
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Thursday, June 6th, 2024 AT 8:14 AM
Tiny
DAVE1970
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Isn't that what I did using the J44152 jumper harness and testing the circuit/system in the image below? That is why I replaced the TCM, and by replacing the TCM, it corrected all the transmission shifting issues, but the P0717 code keeps coming back.
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Thursday, June 6th, 2024 AT 9:21 AM
Tiny
KEN L
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I like to test the wires individually from the sensor to the PCM and do a resistance to ground test as well which the guide shows you. If the sensor is good, and the wiring is good I would send the PCM for testing.
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Thursday, June 6th, 2024 AT 3:54 PM
Tiny
DAVE1970
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Do you happen to have the wiring schematic between the TCM and the PCM, above post is only of the TCM and related items. I don't see anything dealing with the PCM wiring, other than the 4 (tan and tan, black) Data Bus wires pointing to the computer data lines system. Is that the wires you are meaning to test? And if the ISS wires only show going from the sensor to the TCM, how would I test from the ISS sensor to the PCM?
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Saturday, June 15th, 2024 AT 5:55 PM
Tiny
KEN L
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Anytime you do wiring testing disconnect the wiring connectors from the TCM and PCM, this will free up the wiring so they can be tested correctly. Here are the wiring diagrams for the PCM and TCM. The first two diagrams are for the TCM. Check out the images (below). Let us know what you find.
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Sunday, June 16th, 2024 AT 11:45 AM

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