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Intermittent rough idle

Tiny
J-D
  • MEMBER
  • 1999 HONDA CIVIC
  • 1.6L
  • 4 CYL
  • 2WD
  • AUTOMATIC
  • 124,000 MILES
Hello, I have had this problem for awhile. It all started when I was driving and the car felt like it was running out of gas. Didn’t want to accelerate when gas pedal was pushed. Got misfire codes for cylinder one and two. The vehicle would idle but once given a quick burst of about half throttle it will misfire/stumble but smooth increase doesn’t cause problems. Sometimes even at idle it will stumble/misfire. No codes are thrown when this happens. So here is what I have done:

Tested compression
Checked spark with tester
Checked injectors with Noid light
Did balance test on fuel injectors
Checked ohms on fuel injectors
Checked tps for voltage, signal, ground.
Checked fuel pressure
Fuel pressure regulator
Checked vacuum leaks
Checked valves and adjusted valves
Changed plugs
Changed distributor cap
Changed air filter
Changed fuel filter
Checked map sensor for signal, voltage, ground
Checked IACV
Watched o2 sensors on live data while introducing a lean and rich condition and at idle.

so, what I did find was that my fuel pump was putting out ten psi. I changed that and no help. I looked at my injectors spray and number 1 and 2 cylinders seemed like less spray than 3 and 4. So, I replaced them all. After I replaced the injectors the car was doing the same thing when given throttle and at idle. So, I turned the car off and came back a little later and then it seemed like my problems disappeared when I restarted the vehicle. I went and drove the car and no misfire/stumble when given gas or at idle. Well, I came back from the drive and the problems started again. It seems like I can make them disappear if I turn the vehicle off and turn it back on.
I was going to look into the main relay because maybe it is being intermittent. Also, thought throttle position sensor because the problem seems to happen when given a quick burst. Thinking the throttle position can’t keep up. Already checked it though by manually actuating it and reading the numbers. It checked good.
Any help is appreciated!

Thanks,
Jonah
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Monday, December 17th, 2018 AT 4:26 PM

18 Replies

Tiny
KEN L
  • MASTER CERTIFIED MECHANIC
  • 47,185 POSTS
Hello,

This sounds likes classic ignition problem have you changed the plug wires? I do not see then on the list. I would use OE parts for the best results. Here they are on Amazon for $31.00:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000EQB3JM/ref=as_li_qf_asin_il_tl?ie=UTF8&tag=2carprcom-20&creative=9325&linkCode=as2&creativeASIN=B000EQB3JM&linkId=ebe5fdd0df76d37b150b1a02872cfc7a

Please let us know what you find. We are interested to see what it is. Cheers, Ken
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Wednesday, December 19th, 2018 AT 12:53 PM
Tiny
J-D
  • MEMBER
  • 10 POSTS
I have plug wires on order. I was watching my live data for the map sensor and I found that when I gradually increase the throttle from idle to around 3500-4K rpm the pressure didn’t increase from 30kpa. I gave it a quick burst of throttle and held it at that position and I watched the pressure go up but then fall back down to 30kpa even at like 4K rpm. So, I ordered a map sensor.
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Wednesday, December 19th, 2018 AT 1:42 PM
Tiny
KEN L
  • MASTER CERTIFIED MECHANIC
  • 47,185 POSTS
Yep good, Lets test the catalytic converter as well. here is a guide:

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/how-to-test-a-catalytic-converter

Please run down this guide and report back.
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Thursday, December 20th, 2018 AT 9:12 AM
Tiny
J-D
  • MEMBER
  • 10 POSTS
Replaced map sensor and wires. Runs good. Haven’t had any problems for 500 miles. I never did check the cat because I figured I would still have problems if the catalytic converter was starting to plug up.
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Thursday, December 27th, 2018 AT 10:14 PM
Tiny
KEN L
  • MASTER CERTIFIED MECHANIC
  • 47,185 POSTS
Yep, good fix. Use 2CarPros anytime, we are here to help. Please tell a friend.
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Friday, December 28th, 2018 AT 9:34 AM
Tiny
J-D
  • MEMBER
  • 10 POSTS
Problem came back but seems to be more at acceleration under load. Doesn’t do it if it’s in park and engine is revved. Seems to clear up after it has been running a little bit. Most noticeable after starting up and driving after it has been shut off. Getting a random misfire code and a cylinder one misfire code.
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Tuesday, March 5th, 2019 AT 8:24 PM
Tiny
KEN L
  • MASTER CERTIFIED MECHANIC
  • 47,185 POSTS
Those are signs the ignition system is breaking down. Did you install OEM wires and spark plugs? if not that could be the problem.

This guide can help:

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/engine-misfires-or-runs-rough

Please run down this guide and report back.
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Wednesday, March 6th, 2019 AT 2:35 PM
Tiny
J-D
  • MEMBER
  • 10 POSTS
I used NGK wires and I think the plugs are NGK as well.
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Wednesday, March 6th, 2019 AT 3:45 PM
Tiny
KEN L
  • MASTER CERTIFIED MECHANIC
  • 47,185 POSTS
That's good. Can you please shoot a quick video with your phone so we can see the engine running? That would be great. You can upload it here with your response. Also, how does it turn over does it sound even?
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Thursday, March 7th, 2019 AT 9:27 AM
Tiny
J-D
  • MEMBER
  • 10 POSTS
Sorry for the very late response. But I replaced the distributor because I wanted to take the whole ignition system off the list. Still didn’t fix the problem. I performed a cylinder leak down test and all cylinders are all pretty much equal in the amount of air they losing which is only like 5psi. The only thing I haven’t replaced in the fuel system is the fuel pressure regulator. I pulled the plugs and they are all Pretty white in color. I might take the valve cover off again and inspect the valves carefully to see if anything is going on there.
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Saturday, April 6th, 2019 AT 8:07 PM
Tiny
J-D
  • MEMBER
  • 10 POSTS
Video is hard because it only does it when being driven now. It used to do it at idle but now it idles fine and seems to happen more when accelerating. Engine sounds even when turning over.
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Saturday, April 6th, 2019 AT 8:10 PM
Tiny
KEN L
  • MASTER CERTIFIED MECHANIC
  • 47,185 POSTS
I know you changed the spark plug but did you use one of these spark plugs?

Spark Plug ID

D16Y5 Engine
NGK .................... ZFR4F-11
Denso .................... KJ14CR-L11

DY16Y7-DY16Y8 Engine
NGK .................... ZFR5F-11
Denso .................... KJ16CR-L11

BA16A2 Engine
NGK .................... PFR6L-13
Denso .................... PK20PR-L13

If not please change them out. Here is a guide to help you do the job correctly.

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/how-to-change-spark-plugs

Please run down this guide and report back.
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Monday, April 8th, 2019 AT 10:34 AM
Tiny
J-D
  • MEMBER
  • 10 POSTS
I will check em and let you know. Currently out of town but I will let you know when I get back in a week.
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Monday, April 8th, 2019 AT 10:42 AM
Tiny
KEN L
  • MASTER CERTIFIED MECHANIC
  • 47,185 POSTS
Please do.
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Monday, April 8th, 2019 AT 12:15 PM
Tiny
J-D
  • MEMBER
  • 10 POSTS
Spark plugs are the NGK ZFR5F-11. I just drove it around and got a cylinder 1 misfire code. I pulled the #1 plug out and took and picture. What do you think?
Image (Click to make bigger)
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Monday, April 15th, 2019 AT 10:29 AM
Tiny
KEN L
  • MASTER CERTIFIED MECHANIC
  • 47,185 POSTS
Looks lean. What do the others look like? if they are darker I would check for vacuum leaks and if none are found replace the injector. Here are two guide to help:

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/how-to-use-an-engine-vacuum-gauge

and

https://www.2carpros.com/articles/how-to-replace-a-fuel-injector

Please run down these guides and report back.
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Tuesday, April 16th, 2019 AT 11:14 AM
Tiny
J-D
  • MEMBER
  • 10 POSTS
The other plugs look similar.I adjusted the valves cause I was thinking maybe they were off a little bit but no help. I will use the carb cleaner and do some spraying. Already replaced the injectors. The engine idles fine but the misfire occurs under acceleration.

Here’s a complete list of what’s been replaced so far:
Distributor
Wires
Plugs
Fuel pump
Fuel filter
Fuel pressure regulator
Fuel injectors
Map sensor
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Tuesday, April 16th, 2019 AT 7:33 PM
Tiny
KEN L
  • MASTER CERTIFIED MECHANIC
  • 47,185 POSTS
Misfire under load is an ignition problem most of the time. Did you use good quality plug wires? Can you please shoot a quick video with your phone so we can see what's going on? That would be great. You can upload it here with your response.
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Wednesday, April 17th, 2019 AT 11:21 AM

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